Sorry, yeah, that makes sense, I think I get all that, the face rolling stuff. I was talking about a different quote, the part where he says: “The idea is to rotate the club with the left arm. Poor players and even some tour players try to do it with the right arm. You have to do it with the left arm”
So he’s not talking about hands or wrists. He’s talking about arms and he’s talking about the downswing.
Is this about not actively straightening the right arm through the ball? Like rotating the left arm is the alternative to disturbing the right elbow and the arms coming off the body? Or is it some internal pressure thing about how the arms are working against each other? Like it needs to feel more like the left forearm controlling the clockwise rotation than the right?
Doing Mod1 it seems like we’re trying to forcefully rotate the club with both arms, yeah? Or am I confused on which ‘rotate’ we’re talking about here?
He talks about rotating it wide open on the way back with the left, does he then mean by wishing to have three right hands that he rotates back with his right. Rotate open with left, rotate closed with right?
Regards
CP
If you can understand this… it is absolutely pure gold.
I absolutely felt this yesterday in my work on the range with a 2-iron shot that was pured. My thought before I executed it was ‘take it to the extreme and keep that extreme position until P3 and then unleash it.’
Unfortunately, this swing wasn’t on the tape I just sent you. But shocking, nonetheless. Definitely a mental hurdle, but not for long.
Love cryptic riddles Lag.
Interesting pronation picture, but you may be really showing way too much for free. 
I suppose that if one rotates properly at the top to really open the face, it could be sensed as the L arm has an additional pronation function as the integral part of transition. Or, as Bradley states in this video, having his watch go from facing the camera to facing the sky. But that would put us in a position to sense either a backward L palm lead, or simply an opening R forearm, each accomplishing the same objective of turning the watch to the sky during transition and the free ride…then a real late hit at it.
Interesting to see how Bradley’s subconcious displayed continued acceleration up the plane as it relates to the palm. Looks pretty pronated to me. Interesting to watch the video from that point ( 9:36 ) forward for a bit.
One of the few modern SS - Sergio Garcia - interesting I did an video years ago of Sergio and me:
[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PTxfRmxNofI[/youtube]
He slotted it always good back then and now:
But I could swear he comes into impact now much shallower than ever…
In the above vid he double shifts and then is onplane - but on these pics from last Monday he comes
shallower into impact:
Lag you have some thoughts to Sergio…
Chris
Some swing thoughts from Sergio - found in a recent golf mag.
It almost looks to me in that bottom picture with Sergio hitting the driver with the fire the lower body caption that he’s using a little more of a swingers release with the right arm extended pretty straight and the club getting away from him post impact.
With his longer clubs he is much more CF - maybe a must because he stays a long time in forward flexion and would
hit with a CP release much too low Fades.
He is actually a great SS, but his release is IMO a little different than ABS.
He uses a vertical left arm at impact - this keeps the left arm rotated clockwise even
the transition forces want to untorque it. At parallel 3 he uses as well both hands and right shoulder to steepen the shaft back into the ball while also squaring the face. No right shoulder down the plane - instead a shoulder throw…
Sounds similar, but the left arm moves different ( no out to the ball, instead more vertical to the ground… can only
work wtih a big laying off)
Chris
Nice obvservation Chris. I’ve never picked up on that before. Not 100% sure of the term “forward flexion” either. Could you elaborate on this when you have a chance? Thanks…
Watching the Barclays yesterday we got a small victory in the equipment battle. Kostis was analyzing Sergio and emphasized that there was no way Sergio could get the shaft back to address angle with a typical 45-46 inch driver. While Sergio uses the TM R11s frying pan, it is only 43 inches long.
Here is my most recent video as I work in the super slotting module. Getting there:
[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=igWuTxLQTw8[/youtube]
Sergio could, but for what - he is long enough and wants accuracy…
BTW here is a older Vid with my 48 inch Frying Pan… Sure I could shift back to the address angle…
[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PBI0CESHEPw[/youtube]
It was a beast, Swingweight E2 - it slottet without me - broke the shaft after some months.
[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FhygkOFzqjk[/youtube]
I wish there would be more people post there swings - I bet there are some very good SS under Lag´s
tuition…
Chris
I do have some students doing very well with the Superslotting module. However, many students choose to remain passive on the forum front. I do encourage them to post from time to time… and some do… but the majority of ABS students work through the modules in a silent way… which of course is fine.
We look always DTL in the SS - but more interesting is the purpose from FO:
Original SS:
Myself:
Some students which are public on youtube:
IMO they look all great and ready for the task to come…
Chris
Lag, did you ever try to reverse loop it and SS?
What I mean is to go inside and up in the backswing with the handpath and then shift the handpath over, but
at the same time slotting the shaft…
Recently I work on this and like it - but it is a lot of work. My feel is I shift 5 inches and the truth is I shift 1inch over my backswing handpath.
In the past I did it like Grady… up and then down and inside with a downloop…
The blue line is the backswing handpath and the red line downswing handpath:
Somehow I feel there is more angular momentum if I do it this way - but it will be a long way to master it.
[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y7Uv5Y2HrME[/youtube]
Maybe it is just preference how the handpath goes and the slotting of the club is more important!
Chris
If you have both the forearm rotational strength and good post impact torso rotational thrust, then slotting the club deep is advantageous. If you don’t have the strength, then you can slot all you want and enjoy some nice looking photos of yourself coming down and then just watch the ball go all over the lot.
P2 to P3 is really just the setup for the hit. Some ways are probably better than others from a technical standpoint, but if it doesn’t repeat for the player with a sense of freedom and naturalness, then it will be a struggle to strike the ball consistently.
The hands themselves have several possible paths into the slot. They can move outside then loop back in. They can move fairly straight back then drop some. Then can work inside quickly and then up, and then try to retrace those lines back down.
The clubhead itself can move outside at initial takeaway or be pulled inside or any degree of variation between the two depending upon grip position, and when the forearms rotate either early or late or when wristcock is initiated in combination with those options. Lots of combinations and this is why we see so many different looking backswings.
Downswings look different depending upon hitting or swinging protocols to some degree, lie angles and clubhead mass, shaft flex and rotational strengths.
So based upon all that and a bit of personal experiments, my own feeling is that I like the hands staying on fairly close and tight on the backswing to preserve the sense of connection, but work the clubhead a bit more out… then rotate the forearms later through transition to take advantage of a bit of the momentum feeling of tossing the club over the right shoulder and down into the slot while still maintaining a sense of cohesiveness with the right elbow staying in close to the body.
Nevertheless, there are some that clearly prefer feeling the right elbow more out and then looping back in being a nice trigger for slotting the club. I think Bom was mentioning this a while back in some posts. It’s a good way to do it also.
Best to work hard post impact so that one can have the option of deeper slotting down the road, as the benefits are there in helping with more solid contact, eliminating the left side of the golf course while still being able to strike the ball aggressively with a firm deliberate hitting action that requires much less “timing” in the golf swing.
Thank you lag - I am not sure if it is a double or Gerd Fröbe himself, but it is actually from 007 Goldfinger…
[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D_rkUizgquY[/youtube]
[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Kr1Jkq_KMdQ[/youtube]
I like this action…
Chris
Knudson took the inside route on the backswing but still laid off the shaft through transition and flattened the shaft coming down perfectly into P3.
While some argue that the slotting of the club needs to happen from the clubhead moving more outside on the takeaway or keeping the clubhead outside the hands, however, this is certainly not the case with Knudson.
One can clearly see this is not an action of gravity or the shaft slotting through momentum from the backswing. This is taking the bull by the horns and actively slotting the shaft through forearm rotation. I think this method is better because it allows the player to feel more or a connection of the arms on the backswing and assures the club will get slotted.
You do have to train to do this… but it is a very viable method.
I really like how Knudson did it…
This is actually my winter project…
[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ujt0HneYtOM[/youtube]
In full speed you can´t see it anyway:
[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AUq6ad9Pw9s[/youtube]
[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KZ6DvlxMlX0[/youtube]
And yes - not a lot of gravity helping in this variation of slotting…
Hard work, because I have to reverse some movements - but I feel it is
the way to go for me…
Chris