Nobody ever said anything about “giving in” or “giving up”. It happens in less time than you can even blink.
You literally have John on here who, while still claiming he can hold shaft flex, says he can’t do it every time because it take lots of strength and an extremely active post impact pivot to do…yet here’s Range Rat who has the whole thing solved and is just an absolute master ballstriker. Give me a break. You can’t even stay on topic or coherently discuss what’s being discussed. A post ago you talk about “the hands circling the clubhead” and “hitting from the inside” in who knows what context you’re even talking about or how it relates to anything.
Why don’t you just wander out of this thread? It’s very easy to not discuss it if you don’t want to or if it’s out of your depth. This thread is about the science of the golf swing.
If every other measured swing does it, then we must do it too…
Again, when have you ever measured a persimmon, balata strike?
You cant compare modern data, unless you test with persimmon balata. Since we dont have the data, we dont know. If lag doesnt want to spend the money to travel, who can blame him…?
Why not just go grab a persimmon, youll be accelerating past the ball in no time. Cant hit them any other way…
We (ABSrs) all know it happens…feel is real if you’re leveraged with proper gear (because you can feel it since its heavy and flat). Its hard to understand if you dont do it…we get that.
Things are just percevied at a much higher level. Partly because its moving slower, secondly the weight and balance of our clubs amplify spatial and physical sensations. Im sure there is a study that proves these piints, i just dont care to dig it up.
Youll rarely get there with modern gear. Even if the shaft is in lead deflection, it accelerates past the ball no doubt.
I guess when youre turning the corner at 100mph you cant always get the car to turn with you and the brain will make micro adjuatments to make centered contact. The metal still gets stressed though…your GEARS measurements wont matter when we hit our P3, we’ll have our guns loaded. And WE WILL ACCELERATE PAST THE BALL. Who cares if im in lead deflection prior to impact or not…the rocket blasters are engaged. The ball is vapor…
I said “giving up” or “giving in”, no one else, and is what you do when circling outside the hands, that’s fine for you but I’ve lived in that neighborhood, no more.
I use gear, and I’ve said this before, lighter than Lag’s and can use much of the same sequence just like I can use heavier drum sticks or lighter drum sticks, lighter or heavier bat, bowling balls, pick it, my choice but there are considerations when choosing no doubt. As for being a master ball striker, hardly, and never made the claim but it’s a great journey.
It’s not my fault you don’t understand basic swing discussions, might I suggest deck lessons with Lag and he can put you on a more masterful path- but my intuition says you might not know what, or where, that would be.
I agree, who cares? I certainly don’t really care if a shaft is in lead deflection…I just wish claims about fact wouldn’t be made unless it’s fact.
I do not believe persimmon and balata golf shots have a lagging clubhead either. Can’t measure dead golfers from the past though.
“If lag doesnt want to spend the money to travel, who can blame him…?”
I do take issue with that. He’s selling a golf training/instruction program at $600 per 3 module set and he’s making claims about doing stuff that nobody else can do and he’s claiming to be able to teach other to do it…and taking their money for it. Proving what he says is on his shoulders. He can choose not do, but that doesn’t seem very genuine. He has a $40,000 system at his disposal, for free, for 2 days. Unlimited access. Like I said, I’m sure we can crowd source a plane ticket and a hotel. I have personally volunteered to pay for any gas required to drive or get to an airport or whatever. The only caveat is that a 3 party will have the data and post it regardless of what it says or confirms or doesn’t confirm. I will not participate in anything that’s being shielded, manipulated, or selectively shared. It will cost him nothing but time and golf swings. If I had an offer on the table for 2 days of free GEARS access I’d buy my own plane ticket right now and I’d be there tomorrow.
And I do practice with persimmons among other things. It’s all good stuff to do regardless of the ideology you use. Again, I just think it’s important to understand reality (if you’re interested in it) and also feel, intents, and perceptions and to understand the differences.
I cant really argue with any of that. I’m just saying we are all pretty happy here. Its shielded for a reason we all know and understand, it wont do you any good if you arent committed. Nothing really more than that…i was skeptical and I ran around the site trying to see what was so special too. I doubted it all, but i figured id wasted $600 on far riskier ventures, what the hell.
I took twomasters drill series, seemed like a faster route. Lag is a far more involved/strict teacher from what ive heard…not that i didnt appreciate Brads style too. I was in the military at the time…had enough self discipline, didnt want much oversight.
I havent looked back…and ive “felt” it happen enough to know. Ive seen trackman numbers that make fitters scratch their heads. And im not even a full hitter, im definitely a switter.
Anyway, its only good business sense to do it this way. You shouldnt throw shade Lags way for that. Lag and twomasters students seem pretty happy. Brendon Todd turned his career around thanks the Brad Hughes! Track record is solid around here.
GEARS and science will never reveal what youre really looking for. I can tell you want to be on this side…science and modern garbage has hit its limits. Yet you still have vintage sticks…
Try the program, drink the kool aid…take the red pill
I have lots of stuff. I like to hit balls. I’ll take anything to the range. I have a Whippy Tempomaster driver and 7 iron too. But I don’t play old stuff on the course. That’s not what golf if anymore and if you want to actually compete it requires some measure of distance and optimal launch and spin. You’re trying play again Tour pros, you should know that better than anybody.
Irrelevant to the point of the discussion. There are multiple facets to playing golf, studying golf, or learning the science of golf. There are plenty of top tier players who had zero clue what they were doing and “I just take it back slow and smooth” is the extend of their thoughts on their technique. And there are PhD scientists studying the forces, torques, and physics involved who aren’t great players. And there are really good instructors who “go hit a half bucket of balls under that tree branch without no being your head forward” is adequate for the point they’re trying to get across
But the fact of the matter is that, for the INSTRUCTOR, learning more is a good thing. And learning how best to go about achieving it is also a good thing and actually the more important thing.
Basically the GEARS is a big box store minimum wage wanna be golf teachers dream. You get a set of numbers. Go into your book of Golf Tec teaching manuals. And walla, this is what caused you to do this. Let’s fix your number with this drill. And at the same time let’s get you a proper shaft and driver adjusted to offset it as well. You than send them on their merry ways. Off to the big world armoring them up with the latest tech and a million numbers rambling thru their heads. Wow…
It’s just to cookie cutter for me. What variables are you working off of? Touring pro numbers, a bulk analysis grouping all golfers into one lump sum? How do you take in equation factors of height, weight , age etc?
You have to understand what the numbers or graphs are showing, you have to understand why they’re showing that, you have to determine if there’s actually an issue, you have to know what it is you should work toward and why, you have to know how that will potentially effect something else, and you have to know how to get the student to make the change.
You certainly don’t need GEARS to do all of that. Plenty of good teachers have never seen or used GEARS at all. But it does shed light on what’s really going on. Like where hand speed occurs. Like how fast arm angles open up. Like how the shoulders or hips turn. Like how much the spine tilts or extends or how much and when the hips extend. And you see it in 3D instead of 2D seems as if distortions.
If anything can make people enjoy this game more. Than I see nothing wrong with it at all. Same for this drill series offered here. We can talk about the swing until the end of time. But players have to see and feel what their doing. And until one tries these drills. They will never know
Like your tech equipment. You can’t criticize it until you’ve really tried it
I’m not criticizing ABS or the intents or feels or drills. I’m not criticizing whether it can improve students. I’m saying the hands decelerate, the shaft goes into lead deflection, the right arm doesn’t remain “frozen”, and nobody is “holding the face square”. Those things can and are measured on GEARS, we know what really happens, and we have empirical data to prove it…and then we have a handful of full time PhDs in physics and biomechanics explaining why we’re seeing what we’re seeing. That’s all that’s being claimed.
Again, this post is about the science of the golf swing. It’s in the title of the post. “I did this drill and I have the intent and feel of doing X, Y, or Z and it makes me hit better shots” is fine and I believe that to be the case if that’s the claim, but it isn’t science.
Your basically coming here treating everyone like they are wasting their time. Your throwing graphs, algorithms down everyone’s throat making it sound like your in the know. Which I have major issue with
Golf has many meanings for people. For some it is their livelihoods. For others it may just being a way of getting out enjoying the afternoon. Your imperial data may help some but not others. The simplicity of the drills here also have the same outcome. Some want to know every aspect of the motion. Others can care less. Like I said, either approach can help someone’s time on the course than I see no fault in it. For me personally drills out trump non stop data.
