I think this whole issue has been created by Styles sensitivity. To me its nothing new. Lag has criticised LBG and other main stream TGM instructors to no end and he stands by his position. What the fuss? Just showing an LB picture in person???.
That kind of “basic” and “acquired” motion stuff has consumed a lot of my time and I am sure a lot of other people’s time. Now if believe in something different I need to be told this not once but continually preferrably with audio-visual aids.
I wish I could find the link Styles but I can’t - it’s a vague memory of something written in another thread (not the famous 4-barrel hitting one) - nothing defamatory - just a critique of one of ABS’ principles. However, my memory could of course be playing tricks on me, so apologies if that is the case.
Whatever, this is really a storm in a tea-cup.
Regarding LB and Lag discussing golf in a room together, the longer I spend here working on the modules, the more I realize that their ideas on golf are totally different almost to the core. Backswing? Totally different concepts. Transition? No comparison. Grip? Again. Swing plane? Same again. Impact? disagreement. Post impact? Nope. Training methods to achieve all this? Completely different.
Perhaps the only statement I recall LB making that John would find some areas for discussion would be LB’s “The secret to golf is not a position, it’s a pressure”… but even then, it would depend on how you interpret that. That’s OK - different horses for different courses.
Cap’n Chaos, I have no issue with John critiquing TGM, he has been there at the coal face and has earned the right to do that.
I personally do not believe that Yoda has ever or would ever criticise ABS, he would classify it as another pattern and wholly acceptable. His right to declare it as less than optimal is his perogative, bottom line is that his student won twice on the PGA Tour last year, his credentials are sound.
It has been said that this issue has been created due to my sensitivity. Well I am sorry but that is the way I am. I consider John a friend, we have had some great conversations on skype and although I guess he is a little exasperated with me, I will defend him whenever or wherever I see him being attacked. However, this holds true for Lynn Blake as well. Although I have never spoken to Lynn, I have corresponded with him several times. I have the utmost respect for him also.
It will be a sad day when loyalty to friends becomes a bad character trait.
John’s swing was ‘torn to shreds’ by Daryl and Daryl only, reread the thread if you do not believe me. None of the LBG Teaching professionals contributed much to the thread at all. In any case, the better thing to do is ‘be the bigger man’ and don’t descend to other’s levels. 
Styles
I dont know much about the who is who at LBG but is Daryl not their primary attack arm?
Daryl came here at one point …told everyone he was well versed in the book… said he was of decent to average playing ability and had no answer for any question that was thrown at him that was outside his knowledge of what was in the yellow book
He deleted all his posts and walked away with his tail between his legs with a TKO in about round 5
The book is just that…a BOOK… very few golfers of prominence have come from being taught the yellow book rules and those that had fell away because??..a missing ingredient?..something amiss?
Golf is about real time…body functions…club in tow…inner feelings…nerves…lots of different factors
SO…who would you rather learn from?
Someone that knows a book from cover to cover and can get a degree by being a book worm or someone that has experience in all aspects of golf…playing, teaching, traveling, playing with the best, asking questions, using ideals in the heat of the battle, performing well, winning tournaments as well as being book smart?
I read the book. Couldn’t understand half of it. It should not be read like scriptures to people during a lesson. If I thought about 1/8th of the mumbo jumbo that was inside it’s covers I would be slashing away at a range somewhere with XX out balls and hitting block chunk fats that may sometimes hook 
I don’t see ANY champion golfers separating their arms off the chest worrying about flying wedges in an effort to get a flat left wrist…so why is that being taught?
why are we worrying about it and discussing it ? because NO champion golfers do it and therefore we should really have NO part of wanting to see it in our own swings.
It is not a slight on LB…it is pointing out for the benefit of our students that what was going on in that bag whacking video couldn’t have been farther from the position we are actually seeking in the swing…
even if the intent of the video was on the right track (because most people throw the hands back and club forward before impact) it still is not what any great golfer has done and exaggerated or not is an awful visual for a golfer to have in their minds eye… I would say the same thing be it Butch, Lead or anyone else that came up with an impact bag video like that
And by the way that particular picture is not an exception with LB; its the rule. Tell me its benefits not why we are discussing it.
Hey Styles, I don’t think that your comment above is even remotely the case here and still don’t believe there were any ill intentions on Lag’s part. Besides, you have so many other character flaws that your misguided allegiance to the LB camp pales in comparison. 
Captain Chaos
Tempest in a teacup!
Lynn Blake is a gentleman, so is Lag (deduced from conversation and the general demeanor of their words.)Daryl is not an “attack arm” of LBG, just a passionate fan of TGM, whose tirades ought to be taken with some salt 
Lynn teaches it pretty much as Homer wrote it. I do not think ANYONE knows the book as well as he does. Looking at a total motion of Lynn’s swing, or hit I do not see the separation of his left arm. I have NEVER subscribed to actually blasting the arm off the chest. But it has been a pretty good “feels like” to me. I accelarate my left arm with my pivot. Try as I may I cannot seem to get the blasted thing off my chest! Perhaps it does set up a pivot stall, but Lynn always insists that the drive continues well past impact. I personally think that a conversation between Lynn and Lag would be great! 
At the same time it will take all of two minutes before their ideas diverge! I think the best part of a Lag and Lynn conversation is that I do not think that there is a person that can communicate TGM better than Lynn. If you are going to poke holes in Homer’s Odyssey you should at least have a worthy opponent! No disrespect to Dart and co. I think it is more than OK for Lag to “punch holes” in any and all ideas, as long as it is not ad hominem. I am OK with book literalists, as well as those that deal in the darkside. I have learned from Doyle, Blake, O’Grady, Orr and Erickson! Afterall, I am the one that has to dig it out of the dirt! I kinda like it messy! I have always tended towards the thinking that if you cannot beat me then what you can teach me is limited (but there to be learned nonetheless!) O’Grady said “Homer is the man…” because he pushed the envelope and opened a better understanding. To suggest a complete understanding is a bit of a stretch, but I have had a great time learning. I believe that Homer would have continued to revise his work (like Mac apparently does!)
Here’s the latest installment of my interview with Lagpressure.
http://gothamgolfblog.blogspot.com/2010/02/john-lagpressure-erickson-iv.html
Enjoy,
NYC
Someone just brought this thread again to my attention… but I don’t think so much in revision as in adding more content to the modules so that students can better understand the protocols. I have supplementary videos for many of the modules that aid in various students ability to incorporate the concepts more quickly or efficiently. If I see even a few students missing the mark while others seem to get it spot on… I don’t blame them but try to figure out another way of making the point. So more addition than revision. I am always open to revisions though.