interesting day on the range

So I went out to the range the other day to hit some balls and work on some stuff that i had learned from Lag when we played together a couple months ago. Anyway i started with my normal progression, Hitting a few wedges to get the body warm and then worked my way through my irons and into to my driver. I was really working hard on pushing off with my right foot. Really loading the club and holding the flex of it as long as possible by firing my right wrist. Anyway by the time I got to my driver i was really destroying the ball. Just smashing it.

After about 3 swings with the driver I crank on one and watch the ball soar about 275 directly over my target line. Low with very little spin.

Now here is the funny part. THe head of the my driver (r9 taylormade) snapped off of the shaft on that swing and It ended up flying way to my left.

Is it reasonable to assume that I am doing something right in my swing? really having an accelertion type of swing and hold shaft flex? (From my physics days) Seems to me that centripital force would have had the club head landing right of me like letting go of a pail of water while you swing it around. shouldn’t the head have theoretically snapped and gone down and to the right of me instead of up and to the left in a swinging sort of swing?

I havent done the modules…Im on a student budget…so im trying to wrap my mind around what lag and I had talked about when we played together at mare.

I just thought it was interesting and thought i would share the experience with all of you,


More likely God is trying to tell you that you should get a persimmon driver :wink: :laughing: Don’t let Lag near your bag with a hacksaw would be my advice :smiley: In all seriousness its CF that pulls us out to right field and the fight against it that sees us cutting it left.

Cheers, Arnie

Not necessarily, in my opinion. Evaluating where the head landed could be telling, but it may speak to other issues, which would hard to determine without seeing, at least for me it would be.

If those wrists are rolling, that will send it left too…big time.

I pick up many “head missles” at our range that have decided to leave one’s shaft…and they generally always land left of where the customer points to where they think it is out in the field. In fact, when they point and say “it’s right out there”, I start walking at a 45 degree angle left from where they point. Rarely do I have to go right to find it…unless they have hit the mat or turf first…than maybe.

Just curious if you felt some R wrist bend retained as you approached P4.

Sounds like you had a fun day…must be nice to live where the weather is warm. :slight_smile:


Thanks, working on getting a set of persimmons as we speak. I just picked up a set of macs so thats a start to my bag. Hoping I can reshaft my R9 and have it working again. we will see.

Range Rat,

I did feel as if I had the club way behind my hands. I cant be certain that it was right wrist bend but It wasnt the typical rolling motion. I used to swing the golf club like that and this feeling was significantly different.

The things I did feel: I felt a lot of pressure in my hands, A lot of pressure in my right foot, and pretty much pure contact. A different sort of feel in my swing. One that felt repeatable, true. I Guess we will see if that repeatable thing holds up the next time I get out to the range.


A very inspiring morning. Been thinking a lot about accelerating and PV5. I started to see it as a “gravity fight” for lack of a better way to state it. I even think the term gravity has been used somewhere within the ABS threads somewhere if I recall correctly.

Anyway, my whole set up was predicated on “the fight” that I knew I would eventually get to…no other intentions or feelings at setup which I usually have and that have some sort of dropping, or P3 deep, intention going on in the noggin. It was a feeling at address of preparing to fight through the sound barrier and ending up in PV5. It was just a terrific experience for sure…and it was dramatic how just a forward intention changes leg pressures and stance, and a bunch of other stuff just by having an intention that far forward in the process. A great morning…even tried a 4* down 5I, which felt a little too flat for me, but straight as an arrow…so we’ll see. :sunglasses:

Range Rat,

Glad to here your swing is coming along. My swing has improved as well. Last time i went out i shot an 80 at mare island. Got off to a rough start on the front starting out 5 over on the first 3 holes but my round improved as I had 1 bogie on the back nine and barely missed putts for birdie on 11 12 14 and 15. 16 I hit a great iron off the tee and then 4iron in that came up short and landed in the waste bunker. Still managed to scramble and make a sandy par. Had a chip to break 80 from the front right side of the green on 18. Just lipped out and I tapped in for 80.

After watching lag putt when I was with him I changed up my putter. Put a regular grip on it and a different shaft. Decided to start Hittyingmy putts with confidence and it made all the difference. Especially on the back nine when I really got the feel for the greens and my new stroke.

Isnt amazing what intention can do…

Had 2 interesting moments today.

The first was playing around with some different feels spawned by one of Captain’s recent posts. I’ve been studying the P=MxV versus F=MxA lately and getting some thoughts on it squared away in my head. It really concerns momentum and mass, or weight. It finally stuck me in many ways today that the velocity factor really only concerns the clubhead, whereas momentum with mass can be slower but just as powerful. If I stood in front of a slow moving train my body mass would not stop it or slow it down, whereas that same body mass will slow down a speeding bullet somewhat, or maybe even stop it. So it’s really an effort to conserve mass as a cohesive entity that accelerates late creating the force. Captain described a feel of adding weight to the shaft and clubhead…which if you think about can’t be done by flipping the hands because then you have 2 divergent mass sources: the body and the club. Effective mass application would be storing the mass ( body and club together ) to accelerate and the feeling of adding weight to the process is when the L shoulder moves in and away and the club is held low to the ground by the totality of the mass that was moving. Way cool feelings today. Was finding that if my intention was to add weight around low point, it held the CP relationship much better than an intention of adding weight prior to the ball.

The second was an observation really. After my run-in with the guy at the dome, which I wrote about in Rat Droppings, I went to the upper level hitting platform to visit some friends. I don’t ever practice up there as heights scare me. Anyway, from the front edge of the mat to the end of platform before one would fall off is about 4-5 feet I guess. As I was watching all the people up there, not one had a complete aggressive move left, or even through the ball. It was all short looking cut off stuff with very inactive legs…and poor balance.

Of course, that speaks to one’s ability for sure…and there were no tour pros up there, but it was a fascinating observation. :slight_smile:

I think that’s a first…quoting myself :laughing: I forgot to add why I thought it was fascinating.

I can’t practice on the upper level. I can never get through the ball properly as I have this fear of falling off the edge, even though it is about 4 feet in front of me. If I were to video my action upstairs, you would see the master of all fire and fall back. It’s funny really…I can’t do it. I was just wondering if those people I watched were having a subconcious override going on somehow…like a little hold back. I was thinking that perhaps people that have a problem with getting too far ahead of things might benefit from hitting on an upper level and closer to the edge. :slight_smile:

Gary Player used to look like he was walking down the fairway even before he finished his swing. Might be that when you really flush one you instinctively do something similar. That thought on the range from the top deck could be enough to trigger a deep
“don’t go there” reaction without you consciously knowing. :sunglasses:

A lot of merit to that…although I am actutely aware of nerves just by stepping on the mat without a club in hand. Just weird any way one looks at it. I’m happy on flat ground :laughing:

It’s funny you mention Player. I am always surprised the number of people that have difficulty with that step down the fairway stuff he did. I mention that from time to time for people with cement legs, etc…and they just have a hard time with letting things go. It’s much like a cross over move with the feet/legs one sees in a baserunner stealing second base…except opposite leading leg. :slight_smile:

And thus you have deliniated rather clearly the difference between a golf swing and baseball swing.

As the man said, intentions. A baseball swing has to worry about a moving ball, so you give up energy for speed (you won’t hit it as far, but you might actually make contact) . A golf ball ain’t movin’, so you want to max out the energy transfer.

And to keep that slow moving train metaphor (who can resist a train metaphor) goin’, you would notice the difference between the train bumpin you at a steady 1 mph, vs. a train accelerating from 1 mph to 1.1 mph.

Remember, acceleration wants the energy debt paid as the square of the difference between two states. A little acceleration costs a lot.

And thus the holy grail of golf, the pre-stressed shaft; it is a no foolin indication that, for that swing at least, you are storing the energy pretty much as efficiently as possible.

See, we CAN mix science and fun.


Jfish and I played out at Mare today, and on the 15th and 18th holes I had him hit two balls, one with a frying pan and the other with my persimmon. Both times all 4 shots were hit solid… and results where actually about the same… maybe slightly longer with persimmon. I will note that he has a strong hand action that clearly has no trouble pressuring a heavier club, so if there is a slight loss in clubhead speed, there is more force with the added mass of a smaller persimmon head. I won’t speak for him, but I think he might be hooked! The 2 iron he hit into 18 was pretty memorable too right into the back right part of the green uphill from about 210 out with a Mac 50’s M85.

I think he’s a good luck charm for me too!


Dont forget the 2 wood on 12 up the hill that left me with only 100 hundred in. Hitting the persimmon was so nice. It felt as though all of my swings were just an extension of my normal stock swing. Such a different feeling to not have to totally adjust the flow of your golf swing to hit a drive. I love it. Plus its fun to beat people with the old gear.

It was a great time out there with you. Cant wait to do it again soon. going for 64 again? Gotta put in another long one like you did on 16.



how many pins??

65 is my personal best a Mare shot in 09. My personal goal for this year is to shoot 64 there. Now that I can putt with the new concepts… it seem possible. I start thinking about 64 if I can shoot 33 on the front… not an easy task.

I shot 32 on the front nine which is the more difficult nine. #10 I didn’t convert for birdie which is an easier hole, #11 I missed a 10 foot putt but it had about 5 feet of break in it! #12 hit a 7 iron all over the pin but came up just a hair short leaving a makeable chip which I did not make. #13 is an easier hole and I did not make a birdie there either after lipping out from 20 feet. 14 I hit a poor iron and was lucky to two putt from 60 feet. 15 I think is the most difficult hole to birdie because of the green and accessing a proper shot in. I hit a 6 iron up the hill to about 10 feet and sank it. #16 has a false front that you have to land an iron just over a knoll, and feed it down to the pin. I came up 5 yards short and left myself a 60 foot putt which I somehow knocked it in. So suddenly with two holes remaining, I needed just one birdie to shoot 64.
So I was really looking at #17 to birdie, because 18 is a long par 4 … usually a 3 iron into a small green and often a blind shot to boot.
17 is an uphill par 3 usually into a wind, and this had a back right pin. I hit a 7 iron about 20 feet left of the hole. So I roll this gorgeous putt, and it looks like it is right in the heart… but it hits the left lip and spins out and rolls out right about 4 feet. I then lipped out the 4 footer coming back. Parred 18 for a 66. I have never felt so depressed shooting 66! :imp:

The greens at Mare a sloping, very tricky and difficult… and far from perfect surfaces.
So after decades of playing golf, I finally figured out how to roll the ball on the greens last year. Basically realizing I can’t putt… so I don’t. I threw every stroke concept I had into the trash and rebuilt my stroke. I decided to try applying ABS techniques to the greens… and wholla … I don’t think anyone putts good all the time, but at least now I know I have the potential to get hot… where as before… not.

So actually I feel confident teaching putting now… but that was not something I was entertaining a couple years ago by any means.

Underachiever! Annika wouldn’t settle for 64…just saying. :wink:

Captain Chaos

Opening day in Ratville. Beautiful weather!

If the ABS mission in to turn on lightbulbs for golfers about the advantages of CP action one golfer at a time, there is a lot of work yet to do!

Ran through about 350 people at the range. Final tally: 348 goat humpers and 2 orbit pullers! :laughing:

Saw something kind of cool today that I had not seen before and thought I would pass it along. In came two senior woman, one having what looked from a distance a Sunday carry bag.

When I saw it up close it was pretty clever. She had an old pair of blue jeans and cut off one leg. The remaining leg was stiched closed at the bottom cuff. The material from the removed leg was used to make a carry strap. The back pockets of the intact side were velcro stiched and used as storage for tees, etc. A few other features that would be hard to describe, but I have to admit it was pretty cool.

We then discussed it and traded some ideas about it. She may have the next one done similar but instead of removing an entire leg, she may remove just up to the middle thigh area- stich it closed- and use that for additional storage. :sunglasses:

I’ll just log this here b/c it seems like the right place. Went to the range today, blowing consistently 35mph, but into us, which I like b/c the ballflight really exposes your swing–good and bad. Was using my new (old) Wilson Staff Dynapowers, which were just regripped and bent five flat. Hitting most of them well b/c I’m beginning to understand how to get low and left, thanks to some module 3 lightbulbs from Lag.

Anyway, a Wilson rep was there with bags full of clubs and I immediately went for the forged 2 iron and hit it well, even though it was standard lie but felt like it was 3 degrees upright. A beautifully forged club, clean and elegant, but too light and with a whippy S300 shaft. My pro comes over and starts looking in my bag and I ask him to hit my flattened two-iron, which he did, but kept complaining he was hitting it off the toe.

So he asks me, who told you to go so flat. I looked at him and began to say something, stopped and said, the next time you’re free, let’s go to the bar, have a few beers and I’ll tell you some things. One of the last things he said to me before I left was that everyone, even he, needs a little forgiveness. I smiled back as I walked away, (he’s a good guy, good golfer, open minded and has helped me in the past) but I realized I had turned a very significant corner in my golf instruction and was never going back to the land of upright lies, light gear and cavity backs. My clubs may not forgive me, but over time they will give me permission to hit them as hard as I want and not go left…ever again. And that’s all I ask.

Thought I would hopefully on a daily basis jot down some things I hear and see at the range.

Two old guys yesterday, I presume they were friends, each having a ton of fun with one teaching the other. One guy is a beginner of sorts and the old pro is showing him the ropes.

The old pro says to his friend: " I can see everything you are doing wrong and I can tell you how to correct it, but I can’t do it myself, I just know it’s right. :open_mouth: Thank god for friends :laughing: