Thought I’d start a thread for US Open 2011 thoughts/insights/fancies - don’t have any of the first two but 14/1 Mickelson is a strongish one of the latter.
With the course set up even more than usual for length off the tee & scrambling that will play to his strengths & recent form or lack of it, never seems to be an issue for Phil. Having been with him at The Masters, I think the peoples fav might come good here, after all those runner-up finishes in it.
Look forward to any insights on the track & what they have done to it, from those who know it & have played it.
Great track…I came 16th there in the last US Open held at Congressional back in 1997 when Ernie won.
Haven’t played there since but would think much of these thoughts still hold true
…10 is a par 3 which played in reverse direction in 1997 and was actually hole 18- imagine that a par 3 finishing hole in a major!!!. Hole 18 now was 17 when I played there.
The 6th hole was a long par 4 when I played now it is back to it’s original par 5 design…so par was 70 back in 19997 now it has gone out to a par 71 even though length has been added.
Looks like length has been added to Holes 4,11,12,15 & 18
Hole 11 will probably be the toughest par 4, long, uphill, should have a narrow fairway and has a hazard on the right side of the green, which will catch guys out and make them bail out and bogey…
Hole 2 is flat out long slightly uphill with a small green and should be the toughest par 3 although Hole 10 may fight that out because of it’s weird green and depends on wind conditions as to how it will play…
watch out for bogeys on holes 13,14 & 15 when players miss long or on the wrong side…lots of slope down and away…but that all depends on the speed of the greens which I would think (hope) would be firm and fast
It will be interesting to see what the rough is like. I am guessing that since the course is so long, they won’t grow it as long as they used to. I just wonder if we will ever see US Open rough again. If you see a guy hit from the rough and stop the ball on the green then it’s not US Open rough as I remember it to be.
The US Open historically was the one event where you absolutely had to drive the ball straight, but I haven’t seen that as being a prerequisite for quite some time.
Recent winners would support that; Geoff Ogilvy, Angel Cabrera, Tiger Woods, Lucas Glover and Graeme McDowell - all bar G-Mac were much higher up the Driving Distance stats than the Driving Accuracy stats in the year of their victory.
Last night Brandel Chamblee and his crew were yapping on about how the rough was not real high like it had been in years past, and that
the U.S. Open was gonna be more exciting because of the graduated rough.
I normally like Brandel, but I don’t agree with him there…ironically enough just an hour or two before that show was on, I was reading the interview Ralph did with you Lag, where you remarked about how you whipped up on Brandel pretty good in a college match…funny.
Furyk with a conventional grip on like a 22 inch putter?? Never thought id see that, weird weird. I can’t tell the difference between the setup & the one last year for the National. Did anyone else’s catch McIlroy interview on the club rundown on his 6 birdies? 3W SW, Driver 8 iron, 3W LW, Driver 3I (par 5), yada yada. I know he just flushed every shot but come on, there’s only two 4 pars that aren’t wedge in & those are both 8 iron. I guess Olympic is going to play par 58 next year, I guess you could chop down 1000 trees that have been there since the days of Sir Francis Drake & put the tees on the other side of Lake Merced. The Open hasn’t been there since the death of the wound ball, it’s gonna be even worse than Pebble last year. Watching Congressional it isn’t as bad, I know the '64 Open was one of the most historic & the last played with 36 on Sat, I even got to hear the story straight from the horse’s mouth once but because I’ve never played it it’s not personal like the awful changes & illogical setup at Pebble & I guarantee the exact same next year at the Big O, it’s so sad, like watching my childhood home get looted. & torched.
DLIII in his hot pink pants whining that the greens are bumpy & Bubba in the world’s tightest pair of camouflage pants… this isn’t the Open, it’s the Palm Gardens Member-Guest. For everyone who loved Jerry Pate’s orange ball in 1976, I give you the 21st century. Where’s Wally West & his Cosmic Treadmill? I wanna go home.
I didn’t see the outfit, but I did hear about him getting all bitchy about the greens. I expected more from someone who’s “definitely comfortable in his own skin”. What a class-A jerk.
Very interesting comments from the USGA guy on the live feed today from ESPN while following Rory, Phil and Dustin. Synopsis:
Still studying the effects of the new grooves rule. Too early to tell the effect on scoring.
No changes anticipated for the ball. USGA rep. said that average driving distances have plateaued for the past 9 years at 286 yds. He also mentioned that the same quotes/complaints about the ball have been around for the past 100 years.
They (USGA) is vigilant about all of the changes the manufacturers come up with and as long as OEMs follow the equipment rules, there shouldn’t be a problem.
The host mentioned how classic courses are being made obsolete…specifically Marion. USGA rep. mentioned that they just held the amateur there and the US Open (?) was coming there in 2014.
I will admit I was surprised that ave. driving distances have been the same for the last 9 years, but haven’t verified the truth in that statement.
I’m interested in hearing some responses from Bradley, Lag, and any other pro on those comments.
In 2002 there were 394 drives measured on the PGA Tour of 350 yards or more
In 2011 so far there have been 565 drives measured on the PGA Tour of 350 yards or more
In 2009 & 2010 there were over ONE THOUSAND drives measured on the tour of 350 yards or more
They have their heads up their rear ends if they believe nothing has changed in the past 9 years…
If nothing has changed then why do they keep adding 300-400 yards to every course when they set it up for a tournament?
I already knew that would be the response. I’m guessing the USGA rep. is part of the Obama administration.
If the ave. distance is true, I will say that is probably because we see a lot more irons and lofted woods/hybrids off of tees as well. Just me surmising though.
In 1998 on the PGA Tour my average drive was 279.7 and I was T 21st in driving distance
In 2001 the same 279.7 distance would have you 93rd in driving distance
In 2003 the same 279.7 distance would have brought you in at 144th in driving distance
2005 you would have been dragging along at 181st in driving distance for the year
We also have to consider now that many of the driving holes they measure on to get to this average players would be hitting 3 woods and hybrids so the numbers are in actuality lower than in reality… the huge change came in late 90’s early 2000’s when the ProV balls came out and clubheads started to get bigger
They can say all they want about the averages…but they dropped the ball well before that 9 year mark they are trying to reason their logic on
Of course they lie, they are paid to. If they want to lengthen a course like Congressional or any other track out to what it should be for a major it’s gotta be over 9000 yds, 7500 is a pitch & putt with this equipment & ball. Avg 3 par 250, 4 par 500 & 5 par 750 (300+300+150 which is a basic wedge 3rd). Its basic arithmetic but nobody admits it because the ball won’t hold championship greens with anything with less than 35° loft and the players’ mechanics are so bad nobody would ever break 300 for 72 holes. It’s just like Congress, all anybody cares about is about keeping their spot on the gravy train & the endless spiffs, not a damn other thing.
Again, the problem is that, beyond the obvious untruthful answers, the game is not being run by players who understand the articulations of the game and how ball flight is more than just how far it goes. A great golf course is designed to accept a variety of shot shapes into fairways and greens… but also as I have stated before, trajectory. I don’t care if Rory shoots 28 under, regardless of his domination so far in the event, he is not being properly challenged by the combination of golf course and equipment.
14 clubs in the bag.
Ten par 4’s on a golf course should test players with 3 varieties of approach shots. Typically 3 or 4 long irons, mid irons, and short irons. It’s not just the distance, but the trajectory of the approach shot. A big difference between a 3 iron and a 9 iron in trajectory and the precision of shot that must be played between the two. When you then add in shot shape to that you have a game that resembles proper golf.
A quality golf course will have it’s greens designed accordingly to, first and foremost, accept those various TRAJECTORIES.
When I hear either commentators, officials or players talking about the ball, gear and so forth, they simply sound either ignorant or uneducated about the game of golf because they are not really talking about the right topic.
It’s just morphed into a different game… as if you used to watch grand prix racing, and now it’s only drag racing. It’s still racing… but just very one dimensional in comparison. Drag racing is just not interested in handling corners, and variations in velocity.
The only reasonable solution is for the game to fraction off.
Good stuff Two.