Just a thought, does the pix litt.jpg show Mr. Trevio flushing one, or does it capture a push WAY right?
The video sequence is flush to about 2 feet from around 110 yards
The driver I am sure was flush too- it was a still shot pic not a video snip…so i have no exact way of saying yes or no but pretty sure it would be right where he intended it to go…we have to remember Trevino aimed left so the ball’s initial path looks different to where his aim is …Lag talks about the logic of this in the area of the ABS site related to Instructional Books …It will be under Lee Trevino-- Swing My Way-
Using someone who we don’t really reference at ABS -Davis Love III-
I just love this old video of him from the persimmon era- he just clobbered guys with his swing speed with the old equipment…but not only was he long he was straight
[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5Sw61V3oIQE[/youtube]
I can’t get a good grab on his swing from the video but it would be an interesting comparison to these latter photos from 2007…he does have an excellent impact position but through impact the club flies off to the right some and I would suggest that is an equipment issue that crept in over time more than a swing issue
A lot of this may have to do with being told to hit up on the modern driver-- so automatically this post impact position tends to come along for the ride
The beauty of the swings below and why when under pressure these guys thrived and rarely gave tournaments away with miscued shots was the inside attack from 430 and the bent right arm at impact giving them feel and control of the clubface through less twisting or thrusting into impact.
As shown they don’t all have similar releases through the ball but not one of them works their hands independently of the body. If they did we would see the club heading off to the right and much more clubface rotation to a closed position.
I believe this is the beauty of the older era swings. They all worked out the correct formula to control the ball with power and precision yet all looked slightly different in their styles of swing because they weren’t trying to hit positions on a computer screen …they knew the drill and lived the physics of the strike and how their ball reacted through their own feel and practice and faith in themselves with little reliance on outside influences
One of the main objectives of the golf swing…the main thing that helps compression and gives the hands feel and allows for that sound of the ‘crack’ at impact is the ideal of ‘Holding Shaft Flex’ and having the intention of holding that flex through impact and beyond.
I without actually knowing it used to achieve this concept… Lag has posted the following picture of myself in the private section…showing my shaft bending backwards away from the ball…holding the shaft in the correct sequence to fire at impact.
Lag has mentioned this ‘Holding the Shaft Flex’ ideal many, many times on the Advanced Ball Striking Site… The picture of Hogan holding flex is incredible…This picture is from a behind the line view so I just wanted to post this picture here for insight as you can see some key moves (even though this is a still frame shot) that help allow this wonderful concept that help you with your ball striking.
This shot is from the 17th tee in the 3rd round of The 1992 Australian Masters- I birdied the hole and would actually go on and have a 2 stroke lead after 9 holes in the final round. Unfortunately I lost my putting feel in the wind that final nine holes and ended up 4th behind Craig Parry, Greg Norman and John Morse…but it was a great learning experience as I would then go on and win the event the following year shooting a final round 7 under par 66 hitting all 18 greens in regulation on that final day
Great stuff, man… great photo too- you’re right, a real hack!
Do you remember what you felt firing at that point in the swing, or just prior that? Did you feel that acceleration in a specific area/areas? I was wondering also where you ‘felt’ you were directing your force, or the club? Did it feel like you were going left with it or did you feel like you were firing at the target? I’m talking feelings here. Obviously you were rotating hard with the chest, and I assume that felt left? Or did it feel more target directed? This is a fascinating area I think…
Cheers,
BOM
Bom, Here is the video that shows that tee shot and approach and then a couple more from 18 and early the next day…
The way I took the club back away from the ball was with wide hands (extended) and a slight forearm/wrist roll…this helped me set up my late set at the top. From there all I had to do was not be in a rush at transition and the late load would automatically downcock my hands…you can see this by my hands getting down into the impact area quickly while the club stayed behind me and up (Lag)… I stored all the power I wanted and then thrust with speed at impact and beyond as evidenced by the high hands well into the follow through.
Now I have always said Greg Norman was my idol and I based my swing on him growing up…but I did have another favourite in the name of Tom Watson…who was the king of the mid 70’s thru the mid 80’s when I was building my swing…so you will see I had a different release than Norman did…Greg’s club went upwards more on the through swing to the finish…I tended to go outwards more in centrifugal force motion like Watson did after impact up to the P4 position…without so much of the CF fight that Norman really put up in the throughswing.
You can see how aggressive I got through the ball…my hands and body ripped at impact whilst my feet stayed solid and the club just flew up to a high position…from there I ran out of room to go anywhere else, so you will just see my hands drop onto my shoulder to a follow through pose.
My club whilst extending down the target line …NEVER flew off to the right…it just extended out and then went left with my speed… so maybe I was Norman/Watson hybrid because they were the two players I watched the most…Norman up close…Watson only really was observed on TV…although I did go watch him play and win the 1984 Australian Open at Royal Melbourne.
It’s funny how if you observe people you can really get some of their stuff ingrained. I think that’s what I did, as I had no tuition , just built a swing on observation and practice and playing shots on the course.
[vimeo]http://vimeo.com/20242262[/vimeo]
2nd swing is a draw into a left pin…last swing is punch 6 iron under the wind
It is a reasonably minute difference in a still shot…more noticeable with a motion video…but you can see Norman is fighting the CF pull outwards and rotating the club up more vertical at the same point as opposed to Watson fully extending farther down the line using the CF force a bit more through the hit to the finish
This picture gives you a little different view of it…Norman has his right arm bent fighting the club wanting to throw out-- Watson is extending his right arm letting the force of the club pull his arms out more
Cheers, man, great insight. There’s a real sense with your high position in the followthrough that your arms are literally flung up there by the speed of your rotation- there’s just so much speed. Also, I hadn’t really noticed it before until that clip, but you even had a bit of the Duvals going on through impact, which really speaks to your commitment to your rotation.
I know it’s a subtle distinction, but I would argue that ‘fighting CF’ isn’t really the thing that’s happening with Norman or the good guys. My sense is that it’s a stronger and longer acceleration that’s actually increasing CF and keeping the club out there on the good side of the hands. When people succumb to CF, the arms go out to right field while the club goes left because the club is puling them so they follow it out and around or wherever it’s going. The good guys are accelerating internally and with the arms, are actually forcing the club to stay further right longer, or outside the hands, by creating more CF through proper acceleration. They’re still moving the club, the club isn’t moving them. Does that make sense? I know it’s the same thing in many ways, but by fighting CF, the assumption is that it’s already created, in that it exists separate from what you’re doing, and that you fight it. My thinking is that you have to keep creating it.
If you think simply of spinning a lead fishing weight on a string around your hand as it circles… the faster you spin it, the more pressure this puts in your hands. You could let go of the string at any time once it is up to a speed you desire… or you could keep the feeling of resisting pressure and keep spinning it.
The idea would be… do you want to strike something while you are still holding the pressure in your hands? or would you prefer to let go and let the momentum of the weight hit a target that you aim at by timing your release of the weight?
Golf can be played both ways.
This would be the essence of a hit or a swing. In the hit you are still actively involved in the strike… and the firmer the shaft the more you need to be involved.
I really like this visual, thanks for this lag!
Bom and I have been talking a little bit about Greg Norman young V’s older swing…these pics below are from 1982 (with a crappy camera on the range) and from 1995 (from his book Advanced golf)
Very interesting to look at… I always felt Greg was a better ball striker when he was younger… He became a better overall player in mid 80’s when his short game improved and then he changed his action with different coaching and lost the zip …it is noticeable in these shots.
You used to just have your mouth open thinking 'ho^&&^ when you watched him hit a ball back then… the newer equipment and the swing changes took away his edge
Photo 1: The young Norman had a narrower stance and stood taller to the ball with his back more vertical…he had more knee flex like he was sitting his rear down on a stool and his weight was noticeably resting back on his heels at address. The 95 version was wider stanced, with weight balanced in the middle of his feet…neutral and less dynamic looking to me. The younger Norman just looked like he was taking control of the club…the older version looked a bit more careful like he was working more on a spine anle or a body feel instead of feeling the club become part of him…lots of grip wiggling and regripping trying to get comfortable whereas earlier it was just natural
Photo 2: The young Norman had a shorter hand swing but just as big…if not a bigger shoulder turn than the 95 version. I know from my watching him and basing my swing on the 82 version- he tended to restrict his right hip turn in the backswing (even though he said otherwise in books and his early video)…this seemed to restrict his hip turn but coiled his upper body up for great power and turn… the 95 version we see more turn around with the hips…and he would start to get the club longer and across the line a little. It doesn’t surprise me by seeing this that his best golf with Butch was in mid 93-early 94 when he won the British and the Players when he had a very short backswing…This kept the club more pointing along the line he was familiar with . He knew what to do from that position with shorter hands because it got his body moving again to get the club whipping with speed.
Photo 3: The younger version had more Lag in the downswing which goes along with a wide takeaway and shorter hand swing going back…down cocking the club, and the extra weight of the persimmon with steel shaft I am sure helped him feel this also. He also had more knee flex and looked like he was more in touch with the ground…which again goes along with how he had the right foot slide and then after Butch worked for a while it went away…this was one of his true great moves and it was evaporated …on purpose!!! 
…by Butch… I feel the pain 
Photo 4: the younger Norman with the more Lag coming down and the better ground pressures just flew the club up to a faster athletic finish. I never really liked the older Norman finish where he almost snapped the shaft on his shoulder bone in the follow through
Both version of players were great… I just think the younger Norman swing look and intentions was ‘BEAST’…Whatever he worked on with Butch or with this kinetic training stuff altered his action and his ball control and ball flight and sound of the strike became reduced to a shadow of it’s former self.
I love how the stripe on the back of his shirt keeps on moving through the zone on the DTL clip. What year did he start working with Butch?
[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B8W_LgdBh5o[/youtube]
[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eQIMApYcZak[/youtube]
I believe towards the end of 92…British Open 93 was his first significant win with the Butch swing as far as I can remember
Well I stuck this two pics together…maybe I wasn’t that different in the release?
On the DTL shot of GN…What do you suppose the reason for his right foot to go backward first before getting up on the toe. Has he always had that action?
Love looking at footwork. 
Rats like sticking close to the ground…that’s the reason RR…pressure and rotation
This is what our students get to learn quickly on in the ABS program- Module 2 training
Here are 2 videos of the Shark and 1 of myself-- instructors tend to think it’s a bad thing as they have no feel or inclination as to the why and how it happens.
Norman is the best example of this but it is there to see in many other golfers if you look…Player, Hogan, Casper and so forth…Villegas in the modern wave
[vimeo]http://vimeo.com/17929753[/vimeo]
[vimeo]http://vimeo.com/10571928[/vimeo]
[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wjV-Gu6mouk[/youtube]
Pretty cool videos…assuming correct downloaded pressure into the feet from the top.
I guess I see a flatter position at the top as conducive to a more horizontal move first with the R foot before the foot gets up. Whereas with a more upright move going back, it would seem that the initial backward movement of the R foot before getting up on the toe would be to allow more inside space for the clubs journey…since the club is not as far behind us.
Or, another take might be something has gone forward, or out, too quickly and the movement backward with the foot is needed to balance it out.
That might make for some interesting photos to post this summer from the range. Just still photos of customer’s feet at the finish. I sometimes sip lemonade and just watch feet for long periods of time to see if I can predict what the shot did.
You can imagine the different looks…
Interesting stuff. Thanks for posting 
Bradley - great vids of you and Greg and y’alls footwork! I’ve stepped up my mod 2 work since the beginning of the year knowing that it was a weak area for me. Although I’m more comfortable with “doing it” with an actual ball in front of me I am soooo far from that look and consequently I suspect I’m equally as far from the results! 
It reminds me of a video taped lesson I have of Ben Doyle with Steve Elkington. Ben was showing him a simple drill that utilized a wet towel and a bag-stand and Elk was having a devil of a time performing it correctly. After numerous unsuccessful attempts Elk leans over and looks Ben straight in the eyes and says (with Australian drawl)… “but why can’t I do it?”. That’s what I think every time I look at a vid of you or Norman or any other great who used such great ground forces!
My theory is that we seldom have vids of great ball-strikers in shorts and therefore we have no idea how big and strong their legs are. Seriously… anyone got a vid of Hogan in bermudas?? That’s what I thought.
Maddening!
Apparently playing golf in your boxer shorts was trendy in the early 90’s- I must say, I don’t remember that… maybe it was just the Aussies
Two, what are your thoughts on how he shifted into his rear leg on the backswing? He seemed to have a sort rocking pelvis type of pivot action. That pelvic move is more noticeable on close ups, but that shift on the way back was definitely out and onto his right foot- quite un-Hogan like. If he had that tendency it kind of makes sense out of that right pocket going back behind him in the backswing thought that he mentioned a few times. Any thoughts on that overall action and shift? Or the boxer shorts trend 
[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PrBlPYgrqzk[/youtube]