No joke, but that’s exactly what I got… every time too! There’s literally no better dish in world. I got the meal deal with the hot and sour soup and egg roll(with bonus fried shrimp surprise- not sure what’s in that one, they shaped it like a shrimp and it tastes good, so I’m okay with that 
Looks like there’s some stuff to catch up on here…
It’s all right shoulder push on the right, with no pivot unleash. They killed the left arm we’ve been talking about. One of the things about your more modern swing that’s sort of odd, is that it makes you look like a different person. No exaggeration, you look about a foot shorter later on. I honestly can’t believe these two people are the same person- again, that’s not an exaggeration because I’ve looked at a lot of footage of you, and it’s night and day.
There’s no pressure on the shaft, the clubhead has flipped over, there’s no drive. It’s just a big push with the right shoulder, no snap at all. Your right foot has just flopped over onto the toes- just total dead legs. I’d say the only power source you felt like you had was from your right shoulder to your right hand- I can’t see anything else applying force in that followthrough.
What’s funny is that you have that ‘perfect’ line from the left foot up to the right shoulder, the ‘level’ hips and all that stuff… fookin’ Leadbetter.
Though in all honesty, on the bright side, it shows that you could actually do what you were trying to do… that bodes well for the present times, and where you’re at now with Lag.
Looking at the one on the left, it’s just savage, and I’ve used that word before for your action, but it’s a full body and arms unleash- there’s nothing left that you could’ve used to hit that ball that you didn’t use. Like I said to you before, it’s all still in there. That crap on the right has nothing to do with anything.
That’s beautiful- talk about 2 mammoth strikers in the history of the game. Did you conclude right away that it was because of their foot pressure or did you study their actions afterwards based on knowing what they could do to the ball?
Correct Bom and it goes along with what GoLow said also about an upper body release with the legs doing little.
I perfected the action, or as close as I thought I could, but it did nothing to help my swing. I finished straight like you said, I had body rotation around and through…but
It took away my leg action entirely…it just become your normal generic roll the left and then roll the right.
I lost any ground pressures I was really achieving before hand because my entire upper body became the focus of the swing.
My upper body still did a lot of work, definitely more work before hand, but once I lost the foundation below, then my swing became slower, handsy and flicky
That’s why I posted those two different pics…that PV5 position shows it and we see it today in most golfers that are being taught or are playing on tours.
Most of them hit the folded position , very few hit the high position…Tiger does it with his practice swing, tries to reach for the sky, but rarely gets it done in his full swing action, especially with a wood
The clubhead in the 89 pic is flying upwards with a straight right arm, still having momentum from the pivot and the hands/arms working
The clubhead in the 02 pic shows a distinct folding at the same position, meaning my power was spent long before that point and I have nowhere left to go but fold my hands into what they now describe as a good balanced finish
Students on module 3 could spot this a mile away and understand the logic and why it happens…when all the acceleration happens too soon and the force becomes a dump into the ball with out the pivot still actively outworking the hands then this stall, flick, roll release is normal…but not what the great ballstrikers of the past did
see below: Hogan, Norman, Knudson, Nicklaus, Player
I think it should be noted that when you look at any of those players…Hogan, Norman, Knudson, Nicklaus, Player…do you think ANY of them would still have in place, a headcover or a towel under their armpits like modern teaching suggests people to do?.. NO
Two, you have succinctly described a very important aspect here which is that you can’t hit that high PV5 position unless you have very active post impact pivot acceleration. I posted an insight an old member of RCD gave me…he was following Hogan and Tommy Bolt at a major event in Denver in the 1950s and Bolt during the interview was asked about the up and coming youngsters…his reply was a little caustic…‘just a bunch of flippy wristed kids!’
(pics from the vault)…Tommy Bolt- he had it right
It’s an ancient Chinese secret that the “shrimp surprise” similar to the “crab rangoon” is not made with the requisite seafood actually in the dish. Chinese culture allows for an aquarium full of said live crustaceans watching while the menu item is being prepared, thus lending their name to the food. 
Captain Chaos
This is interesting and I think it’s pretty relevant to the overall deal. As the game has shown over time, there isn’t an ‘ideal’ grip, but I do think there are ways to grip it that make things easier or harder because there’s a reality to way the body functions. It’s kind of my deal with the backswing, obviously there are a million different ways to do it, but if you work backwards from how you want to strike the ball, you can find easier or harder ways to make that happen.
With the grip, having the right hand under or strong complicates things for a lot of reasons.
In my line of thinking most people HIT or provide the ‘force’ with the right hand, (their bottom hand) so if that hand is positioned way out the norm on the club then that is going to spell drama
So history shows not too many strange looking right hand grip positions…however history does show many left hand variations of the grip and I think it is all related to just how good your rotation skills are with your forearms and body that determine how that ‘guide’ hand (left or top hand) can be situated on the club
This is a great thread.
This is a question for both Two and Lag.
Is it possible to have the whole swing felt through the feet and legs so that it feels as though they are the cause of all the other moving parts - so that not only do we start the swing from the ground up, but through impact and post impact we also do the same. While I was working on module 3 this evening I felt that I could make it all happen by working on my feet and leg pressures. Similarly while working on module 6 I concentrated on feeling the right leg resisting the weight of the arm+club going back. In each module it feels like I can put my sensors into my feet and have that work move the other parts.
Another question perhaps for both Two and Lag. Do you think Two’s backswing (wide with late set) could be used in the ABS hitters protocol? And did Two use a lot of forearm hitter rotation?
Too many questions? 
I just want to say this is much appreciated Twomasters. It’s a real honest, and very educational thread. I appreciate it.
I wonder how you thought about impact with your ‘feels’ at a younger age. You said your hands hit hard, but did you feel anything more specific? did you think left hand flat? or Left hand first, or right hand thrust? Anything like that? What if you wanted to step it up, and get some more yardage out of the driver?
In any of this, do you feel your tempo changed? (Sorry, I have to ask)
I am not suggesting my wide late set is the best way to go…far from it…no-one I know as a teacher promotes it because they can’t do it or don’t understand the intentions of it so to most people it looks strange and loose and out of the ordinary (Garcia)…
Lag was the first person who ever told me just how good that backswing was, but he also stated you had to have your other ducks lined up in a row to be able to do it…
It was however certainly the way to go for ME because that’s how I based my swing to feel the pressures in the lower half that you suggest and get the club moving and dropping and loading from the top to the strike and beyond…, even though at the time I didn’t really know those intentions and how they really helped…because I was just basing my swing on mainly one person alone- Greg Norman…so I didn’t know what I was doing really. It was just instinct and mimicking someone and what I thought their intentions were. I practiced and practiced and it become my swing based on these feelings and I trial and errored it until I got it right.
I think Lag will have a better response because he understood more about the swing because of his TGM background and also because I am sure he worked on all types of different backswings to achieve the end result, and knew about hitting and swinging protocols and such. I only ever heard about that hitting/swinging stuff 2 years ago when I first found Lag’s thread on iseek. I had not a clue what they were all discussing.
We know Norman had a nice hitters release…mine was more a swingers release…especially with the long clubs and I was bordering more on being a ‘switter’ with the shorter shots…IMO
Bang on. The right hand(low hand- sorry lefties) is about power for sure, but it’s also a ‘visual’ hand, so it plays a big part in how we move. When you piss it off and make it do something that it doesn’t want to, it gets angry and does bad things. And because it has a lot of power, it can really mess things up.
I just mentioned in my previous post (while you were writing this Prot) that I had no idea about hitting or swinging or driving or thrusting, so I don’t believe I put too much thought into the impact side of things…
flat left wrist seems to happen if you power up in the appropriate part of the swing…that’s why those TGM videos of people just thrusting their hands forward at impact and then stopping just causes me headaches to watch because I think it is far removed from the truth of what actually occurs.
My impact became a result of the loading back and dropping down. I had so much lag to deal with in the hitting arena I just poured on the power…with my hands hitting hard to get the clubhead back down and also I felt a distinctive chest power or chest speed up to keep that club ripping through and up to my finish…To achieve this I obviously had to have good structure with my feet to allow this speed and thrusting to happen.
If I wanted to hit one harder with a driver…I concentrated on slower back to get it even wider (which gave me more angles down) and then really concentrated on chest speed through impact to keep on moving that club
Again this is all thoughts now thinking back and some of it may be mentioned and talked about because of conversations with Lag about my swing but I honestly believe I did these things… (without having my words being influenced by what Lag has told me about what he thought that old swing achieved for me)…
That’s why I love the ABS modules…it brought back a lot of memories for me of why I did these things with my swing even though at the time I again say I had no idea of what I was doing… It’s been a weird full circle for me getting back to my basics by being a part of ABS
Great description. I had to pull this out as it goes really well with it…
Funny! So that’s how they get that faint(very faint) aroma of seafood into those things.
What Tiger does in that practice swing and what Bradley and the guys in those photos back there are doing, have zero connection in my opinion. These guys get to 3rd by running around the bases and sweating their asses off. Tiger just runs from home plate to third in a trot. If you just walked into the ballpark you might think that he’s a in a great position to score, but the fans who’ve been watching know that he’s already out.
Found these pics…awful hand roll…just a pure sign of too much hand action and steep shoulders and not enough pivot work and ground work - which was never part of my younger swing- or at least not so soon after impact
Incredibly these were from The Aussie Masters in 2004 when I should have won again, but hit a pissy drive on the 72nd hole just off the fairway into a new shrub they decided to plant for fun when they did the redesign…made double and lost by 1 stroke…they took the bush out not long after…no comfort in that 
I guess my timing was on that week but the process of timing the dump and flicking the hands caught up with me at the worst moment- the 72nd hole-- and that’s what happens…the dump and roll can work when your timing is on and if it isn’t it is a constant battle
Here is the run up to full PV5 as shown by Tiger
top left pic is 1999…right when he was at or just before his peak…top right and bottom pics are from 2009
Perfectly straight up shaft position in 99 showing acceleration with pivot…folded shaft position in 09 showing a slow down of pivot and hand velocities
So where is he dumping the power of his swing? the bottom pic will show that…
