Trail hand action

Lag is teaching rather [size=125]active hands[/size] and going through things noticing that I had posted a while ago on this subject on another forum I thought to post it again being perhaps still of interest.

I like this post as it typically describes a paradox often occurring in golf. Definitely trying to do one specific thing yet it doesn’t materialize and something else happens instead. Indeed it relates to the ‘invisible exertions’, an expression deftly coined by George Hibbard. A nice criterion for separating real from fake instructors would perhaps be checking if they teach effect or cause.


Lag is consciously trying to exert maximum torquing via the trail arm/hand/wrist (and lead hand/wrist ?) but has learned to keep matching this torque with an always more dominant torque exerted by the core. The torque exerted at B, if left alone, will tend to break down the lead wrist and cause it to bend. If however the core torque exerted at point D is large enough it overrides the effect of the torque a B and will help maintain a flat lead wrist.

Interesting stuff, Mandrin. George Hibbard?!? Oh, boy…there’s a name from the past… an old poster and golf teacher.

I’ve read Bertholy’s book some years past. The man was ahead of his time and a real free thinker.

Captain Chaos

Great paper, Mandrin… again, thanks or sharing…
Takes me a while to get my head around diagrams etc. but this is very interesting indeed…


You are unlocking the Da Vinci code of the golf swing…

Good stuff…
Nice to see you understanding the overriding inner force situation.

I have hidden the secret to the final module inside the following code.

Clandermaster svendelisk oggmutonbutton

Working hard…

Art ?

Science ?

Both ?

The more I think about this paper the more I love it… makes so much sense and is so simple in a way. I was thinking about old school advice meeting this kind of science and the old phrase “hit through it, not at it” may have been wiser than they thought. It could all be so simple!


I really appreciate your enthusiasm. Generally there is not that much appreciation. Usual comment…interesting, but let’s now talk about more important things. :wink:

Experimenting continuously one can end up with a bewildering assortment of concepts, feelings associated with different ways to swing a club.

However, trying to formulate certain aspects of a swing in a scientific manner forces you to think of basic causes, the bare bone structure.

Having a very simple blue print of the basic action of the trail arm in the down swing might help to put some structure to one’s search.


DAMN NICE WORK SON…I, for one, certainly appreciate your comments and efforts…If we ever play, I’ll give you 2 strokes in gratitude…but Captain has to buy at the turn. :laughing: RR

Range Rat,

You would be surprised some of the unpleasant epithets generously thrown at me in the past for maintaining a neutral scientific discourse on a golf forum.

Been thought of as the Satan himself, and even been threatened to seek me out and, once at my door step, not quite restrict action to simply say hello. :laughing:

Similar discourse on this forum yet such a different reaction. Hence, I do appreciate your fun remarks. I might possibly need more that two strokes. :wink:

Been studying the gallery pictures a lot…and some stuff on YouTube regarding Hitting or Swinging.

Perhaps another way of determining between the two, besides perhaps R arm/elbow action, is to look at the action of the distal phalanx of the trail hand thumb post impact…in swinging not much bend…in hitting, much more pronounced bend. Very difficult to see in the pictures, but Hogan’s R thumb distal phalanx is bent big time post impact…hitting.

I’m thinking the thumbs distal relationship may be the result of intent, physics, and “the fight”…just thought it’s something you guys might want to take a look at just for the hell of it…like us rats do…and maybe a “new rule of thumb” :laughing: RR

“distal phalanx”…you Rats must study Latin or Anatomy on the range…I love it.

But clarify what you mean by “bent” vs “not bent” please. Sounds like you might be on to something RR.

It’s easy to see if I show you where to look… :laughing:

Check out the Form 1 Hogan picture on page 21 of the Lag, Lightbulb moments thread…it’s real difficult to see, but check out the bend in the R thumb.

Kinda like this…if twirling a rock on a string the thumb is straight and pinching against the index finger to hold the string.

If punching an alien intruder…the thumb is bent @ the distal phalanx.

Quite a few pictures on the gallery in which the thumb is bent from what I can see…“hitting and fighting.”

Other pictures of dumpers with no need to bend nearly as much because the fight is not there.

Rats have small brains…but are good at puzzles and mazes :laughing: RR