Here is a quote from Chuck Evans (that he wrote in an online forum)regarding what he was able to observe about Hogan’s swing action,
“I also have film of Hogan, about 10 hours, that include one of him giving a clinic, and one of him practicing - you can see Garnder Dickinson in the background watching him, and one of him at some friends house at Seminole Golf Club. If someone studies Hogan they’ll see he went from a “double-cocked” wrist position at the top to an “arched” wrist position at the START of the downswing thus putting the clubface into a Angled Hinge position.”
Bagger
Thanks for the video post of Hogan on Ed Sullivan… nice to see Ben with a sense of humor, not something seen a lot…
As far as his cupped or bent left wrist, it’s a very logical action if you are looking to maximize the rotation of the clubface.
It also acts as a clutch or delay between shifting gears from the backswing to the downswing. Very much an anti over acceleration circuit breaker… very advanced stuff…
In the 1951 Movie “Follow the Sun” about Hogan’s comeback staring Glenn Ford as Hogan, the real Ben Hogan insisted upon hitting the live golf shots in the movie. Although many believe those shots were taken at Riviera, they were actually taken at my childhood home course Palos Verdes C.C.
Many of the members when I was growing up were actually there at the time of the filming and talked about what it was like to watch Hogan play our golf course. Ben loved the course because it was “still is” a real shot makers golf course.
On the 5th tee one of the members asked Ben which hole he felt was the toughest tee shot, and he looked up and said, “This one right here”
It wasn’t known if it was that particular hole or just that whatever drive you are going to execute is the toughest…
Here are some pics I took last week as I revisited my old stomping grounds near Los Angeles. I credit a lot of my own obsession with accuracy from growing up on such a golf course, such a wonderful test, Palos Verdes C.C.
And yes, that is a 220 yard tee shot from the par three 4th hole, to a postage stamp green from an extreme elevated tee. I took this shot from the blue tee, as you can see the white tees just below…the ocean is about a mile away so a big left to right wind is an afternoon delight as well…Hit the green or die!
the rest of the pics I posted in the “Birdies and Bogey’s” section on this
When I first saw the photos in the “Birdies and Bogey’s” section, my first reaction was how fortunate you were to walk that place as a youngster growing up, and you got to cut your golf teeth there. It’s easy imagining a kid immersed in the spirit of the place for itself and then the golf there being much more than the score. A youngster wakes in the morning, morning after morning, anticipating what each day out there will bring. Great.
For some reason your pix and description makes me think of a clip in a VHS tape of the Shell’s Wonderful World of Golf - Hogan vs. Snead, at Houston CC. You probably have the tape or have seen it. It’s a short interview of Ben inside the ropes during the round after an impressive shot from a tricky side-hill, down-hill lie to a pin below him. Ben describes how he sensed the wind as it came up in the trees as he prepared for his shot and how sensing the wind adjusted his preparation. To me it feels his description is strongly animated by his close connection with the natural world and how the natural world informed his instincts about his shot. It’s in his eyes, smile, and body language as he tells about it. The shot is the wind’s shot too in a way. When I replay the tape, I believe I sense his preparation a little more as he experienced it. I’m grateful he was motivated to describe it. We got to know him a little better. That Shell bit is a gem.
I first heard or should I say noticed those words of Hogan after playing the 12th hole. He is interviewed by Gene Sarazen…
Hogan says this after hitting a nice wedge shot off a hanging downhill lie to an elevated green to about 15 feet left, exactly pin high… He made the putt for birdie.
“I had a little wind off the right, just before I started to shoot, I could feel the air in the trees and the leaves rustling and I knew I had to hit it a little harder. So I hit it just a little harder, but unfortunately I drew it a little bit, but I got away with the putt Gene.”
The thing that struck me years ago was the comment “I could feel the air in the trees…” I think the word feel is a very insightful choice of words. I suspect most would use the word “hear” or “I could hear the air rustling in the trees” but the way he says it almost implies that he was so connected to the shot and the experience that he could feel the air up in the trees as if he was actually up in the trees feeling it and how that would affect the ball as it would climb in elevation. It’s a very mystical comment… there is a lot there if you think about it. Shivas would be proud.
I noticed it while I was working with a mental trainer, who’s background was really more in martial arts, kria yoga, and other metaphysical disciplines.
I showed the clip to him and he felt that this kind of awareness is what separates the good from greats in most any endeavor. A spiritual maturity or higher awareness. It was this kind of way of thinking that we worked on and he customized a program of sorts for my personal objectives and direction at the time.
This is exactly why I don’t play by yardages. When my intuition is keen, my yardages are better now than when I was using yardages. By not using them, I am much more open to my surroundings and allowing my mind and feeling about a shot to take over, without being concerned about the yardage number. I feel the shot, and the yardage, and it keeps me in the shot much better than when I was playing more robotically. It’s also much more enjoyable to play golf like this, much more free feeling and natural.
I find this subject very interesting. I have always though I would get round to doing my yardages, and have a laser range finder. The strange thing is I find myself wanting to hit the club I wanted to hit with my gut feeling, and just end up justifying it to myself with the “exact” yardage. Although it did surprise me and help me by my wife Lisa standing up range and zapping me with the laser for CARRY distances. I was surprised by the result of that.
I think many more people wish that they had gone with their gut feeling than with the yardage and club that it suggests they should hit. I think a poll would have
“I should of hit the club I felt” would win over
" I should of hit the club the yardage chart said"
Although I am sure I heard Hogan could eyeball a yardage very accurately.
In fact by eyeballing it I don’t think many people get things very wrong. The subconscious calculates so many things the conscious mind couldn’t even comprehend.
Not many people I imagine practice “guessing” yardages and verifying it by pacing or laser, another thing to spend time on now we are not bashing balls at the range
I suspect that on a still calm day playing into greens that hold from flat lies… and knowing your club yardages could certainly be helpful… but most golf I play is not under those conditions.
More like,
Downhill lie, wind into me from left to right, a firm green that may or may not hold the shot… multiple trajectory options…
I think most people could look at a target and get it within 3 clubs… a hard 8, a standard 7 or a buttery 6. I always feel I have the right club in my hand… it just depends upon how hard I am going to hit the club based upon the shape of my shot…
If I am cutting it in or drawing it in… these are different trajectories, and also distances. A 6 iron right to left is a club longer than one I cut in.
I’m not saying you should give up yardages… it’s good info, certainly to get you in the ball park. My point is… that if your gut tells you something different… do listen… it’s more right than wrong.
After years of searching, I finally found Hogan’s intention. Not what he did, or said he did, but what he attempted to do as an overall process that takes care of the “free ride”, pivot firing, hand snap, and the rest. And it does not work with velocity…only acceleration.
It’s absolutely counter-intuitive…but so pure in intent it’s ridiculous and, by the way, totally backwards in approach. And it’s like he said… if we reverse our natural thought, or actions.
A dead-weight counter fall to P3/4:30 is the effect…what is the cause! For those who think the L hip, please go to the back of the class and try again.
Having read a fair amount of Hogan stories and biography literature, I really do feel Mr Hogan was thinking…
“I worked it all out myself, let other people do the same…”
He worked for everything he got, ridiculously hard, and not just the golf swing…his mental processes also.
I don’t think he told anyone all the things he worked out…and as we know, feel is not necessarily real. What he felt he did, and what he did were different in many aspects.
ABS comes closest to teaching a Hogan action, with the premise that it is NOT teaching a Hogan action. Just the biomechanical movements he and all the great ballstrikers made.
I myself am going through a transition in module 6 which is fundamentally changing my action. It’s tough going but the results will be immense. Hogan knew his swing and what he wanted to do from studying the greats. We should too…
My feeling is that “Hoganatics” need to be very cautious when trying to emulate Hogan’s action… particularly in the modern game because of the trend in gear. Hogan would not play lightweight gear if he remained interested in precision accuracy for both directional and distance control. How Hogan loaded the club at transition had a lot to do with using heavy clubs.
Also, swinging flat must be accompanied by flat lie angles, and this is another horrific mistake I see Hoganites making by not flattening their gear.
Not much about Hogan’s swing is going to make sense internally until you set up your gear flat heavy and stiff.
The other major oversight people make is how Hogan released the club. You see passive hand swingers entertaining these big angles on the downswing… and this also can spell D-I-S-A-S-T-E-R.
You will also see Hogan fanatics concerned where the club is at the top, and wanting it to be parallel to the plane line, and this also is fools gold.
Hogan’s legs were damaged in the accident, and I think his leg work suffered some because of it… I personally think Knudson had the better leg work and foot action… because of healthier legs… the concepts are the same.
Another issue is Hogan’s grip, which worked with his release intentions… being pivot driven… because if you take a Hogan grip, but still throw the right arm at the ball, and stall the pivot, this can be a less than desirable combo…
So there really are many of these things to consider… Hogan’s action is a complete package deal, you can’t just use a couple of the concepts and leave out others to your own personal discretion… and this is what most do.
Hogan was very big on rotating the forearms as I am also…
It’s the forearm rotation that keeps excessive arm travel out of the swing. People think Hogan had a short backswing… but that is only if you are looking at it as a two dimensional swing plane. If you take all the popular swing plane theory and toss it out the window, only then can you understand the advantages of laying the club off into “the depth” of the third dimension. It allows for a massively pressured entry into impact rather than the passive guiding the club down stuff “trying to keep it on plane” and usually failing miserably.
Does anyone remember the picture of Hogan with his 16 clubs laid out on the ground? I can’t remember where on this forum it is.
I wanted to send it over to Barkow to discuss when the 14 club rule was put into effect… and how that affected both play and the marketing of golf club sets.
so here it is
RR
