Right Leg Loading and Weight transfer

[Budman]

Sick video. To be able to strike a ball solidy with that much movement going on with your body takes years of coordination development (or a lot of takes we didn’t see…)

Anyway, I have to differ here a bit. Just because you demonstrate one CAN hit the ball with no weight on left foot does NOT mean this is what IS happening when one does have ability to use their left side (not zero ground contact of left foot).

I see here a huge exaggerated lateral move back and through. Much more than ever has happened in a world class swing. Happy Gilmore like. But lateral motion adds very little clubhead speed, yet does add a much more degree of difficulty in properly timing a strike. It is why the advocates of “modern” swing theories are trying to delete that unnessassary move. If it does very little, why have it and have to coordinate one more thing? While starting and staying left as in S&T may be an extreme over-correction, surely staying more centered would be ideal.

I have watched a ton of swing videos, past and present, as I am sure we all have. Planting the left heel down first to start down move (or very close to it) is, in my opinion, a hallmark of the greats. I am surprised to see you say otherwise because it is obvious as day. This motion of planting IS a weight transfer. It starts with the planting and by impact the right foot is the one almost with no weight. The tippy toe look of right foot at impact means there is little weight on it. In your demonstration your are on a flat right foot at impact.

Is the greatest ever not planting left very soon after reaching top of backswing and what little weight is on the right foot at impact not just on his toes?

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4vSppPR2ChI[/youtube]

Todays pro’s are evolving to still load right side it appears but removing lateral motion by pivoting more stationary.

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B3P3HKyXOEc[/youtube]

[bspeck]

Budman,

If u watch closely…hogan is trying to keep his right foot down. His right foot is grinding up turf, which eventually comes up to a tip toe finish due to his body rotation. The left foot provides balance and stability. Even though it may look like hes shifting all his weight when he plants the left foot down, majority of his weight is still on the right foot pressuring down, grinding up turf. He did not passively let the right foot slide over, he was trying to resist it.

Its very confusing topic for sure, because what see is not always what we think it should feel like. Many times, its the opposite. Only way to truly understand is to experience what they did thru proper downward pressures and opposing forces. These proper feelings is what paints the picture perfect swings we see.

[LipOut]

@bspeck

If u watch closely…hogan is trying to keep his right foot down. His right foot is grinding up turf, which eventually comes up to a tip toe finish due to his body rotation. The left foot provides balance and stability. Even though it may look like hes shifting all his weight when he plants the left foot down, majority of his weight is still on the right foot pressuring down, grinding up turf. He did not passively let the right foot slide over, he was trying to resist it.

I think there are shades of grey here. As with all observational learning - it’s difficult to tell what’s truly going on. If you see the right toe in the turf late and sliding - there may be some weight there but there certainly doesn’t have to be. In any sport where you transfer weight, you have options for what you do with the foot where the weight started. If you think about a pitcher pushing off the rubber - once he plants and throws he could choose to drag that toe down the mound or he could choose to let it come up in the air as most do. If the analogy is too obtuse, take a look at Jerry Barber. He never moved his weight right but still gets his right foot folding down and could drag it if he wanted.

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m8lLMtnK3DE[/youtube]

I’m not saying this is the right way to do it - I’m just saying that I think you have options and you can pivot only on the right, only on the left, or like most people - around the right then around the left with the weight and center of mass both moving from right to left. There are one legged people who play good golf, I’ve seen it.

I think the toe drag / turf tear is more related to cohesive tension in the body where the player is contracting all muscles, especially core muscles. The tensing down through the legs will cause the foot to drag REGARDLESS of where the weight it.

Just my 5c.

[nfbandon]

We have been debating this issue on my thread on SITD for days. I for one didn’t fully believe John on this point before the demonstration and the explanation John presented. Then Bradley made a great post about guys that carry a big angle into delivery (and I do) need to transfer later to properly release that angle through the strike. I have had a range session or two where I worked on this, and I will tell you my divots are much better. Before I would have the ocassional steep divot, but not doing this. And it just makes so much sense to leverage the ground behind us when we are wielding a heavy object at speed. I find it much easier to rotate and feel like I can support the club much better.

[lagpressure]

If you were to look only at the pic on the right… with legs… it would be easy to come to an absolute conclusion that weight is much more on the left foot than the right. Most would believe that to get the legs to look like this… one would need to transfer weight left as quickly as possible.

However… if we define weight as force or pressure measured at the ground… then the picture on the left shows that no weight has been moved to the left foot yet.

But mass can move laterally without pressuring down into the left foot. It would be very difficult to move mass laterally without any opposing pressure or force being applied. This is best done with the right leg. The right leg is in a very good position to push mass left.

All great golf swings that I have seen increase right knee flex at transition. This loading into the right leg increases the range of motion of the knee to push against the mass of the body toward the target. There is nothing wrong with some mass going into the left foot in a normal golf swing… but if the right knee starts to straighten from the prior flexed position… it is going to try to push the mass up but because of our weight and lean angle of our rear leg… it moves mass more laterally… it doesn’t move mass down into the left leg as much a people want to think.

But because mass is moving left… our eyes want to believe that there is a big load into the left foot much earlier than is actually happening.

Another thing to look at or even try yourself… is the difference between the right foot sliding passively across the surface of the ground or grinding down into it. The grind manifests more downward pressure being exerted into the ground than a foot that is just sliding weakly across the grass.

[lagpressure]

Also,

If I flex the right knee down… I am allowing mass to lower or lowering my center of gravity. This will also put the left foot on the ground if it has lifted at all. I certainly don’t feel like I am slamming my left foot into the ground… although it might appear that way.

Why does mass have to move left, laterally… or move at all? It doesn’t for pitching or shorter shots. But longer irons and woods require much more resistance to the change in direction created by the CF of a longer club and possibly a quicker tempo. It should not be underestimated the affect of applying additional force into the golf ball. The forces of impact work to slow the clubhead, the shaft and the body. Mass moving left along with the rotation of the torso is a very powerful combination to inhibit any slowing down due to the impact collision.

[crr]

@nfbandon

We have been debating this issue on my thread on SITD for days. I for one didn’t fully believe John on this point before the demonstration and the explanation John presented. Then Bradley made a great post about guys that carry a big angle into delivery (and I do) need to transfer later to properly release that angle through the strike. I have had a range session or two where I worked on this, and I will tell you my divots are much better. Before I would have the ocassional steep divot, but not doing this. And it just makes so much sense to leverage the ground behind us when we are wielding a heavy object at speed. I find it much easier to rotate and feel like I can support the club much better.

Ca you link to Bradley’s comments? Sounds interesting…

[nfbandon]

CRR here it is less the pics Brad posted:

A LOT of this discussion has to do with how one releases a golf club.

The person who can hold bigger angles down and into the impact area…will definitely be advised to feel more of a right foot pressuring and never getting too far left…as they hold wristcock longer and have more torso rotation to utilize and can have the ball in a much more forward position in the stance to get at WITH upper arm connection and can deliver ALL that with the motion working more from right to left and beyond

The person who can’t hold bigger angles down and into impact…will definitely be advised to feel more weight left side, will have less torso rotation saved for entry and a farther back ball position…as the wristcock is not held as long and the cluhead gets released earlier and some disconnect of the upper arms occurs.

Mix the two up and you are screwed…

I myself never felt too left…I felt a distinct pressure in my right foot all the way until it got ripped away from the turf with post impact…My right foot had my full attention…my left foot was just there

Did I go left…SURE…Had to so I could balance myself…
.Did I try get/stay/go left …NEVER

When I did receive instruction later on my coach wanted me to be feel more left/set the club earlier…all that jazz…BUT…It felt crap and didn’t work well and chopped any footwork out of my swing basically cutting my legs off and totally changed my release (as talked about above)

So…I think it very important to understand your release first before you get too worried about where you feel the weight…OR…our understand where having your weight is going to effect your release…don’t mix and match
If you can hold angles and keep torso tilt and rotation…you should be feeling weight pressuring down the right…
If you can’t hold angles and get the torso square early you need to be feeling more weight left…
and both will affect where you should have your ball positioned and what the rear arm is going to do and how the left leg reacts into straightening or softer.

I don’t believe John is wrong on this point and others aren’t entirely wrong either…it just depends what you know and what you can do and what you can wrap your head around based on your capabilities. Based on my experiences and knowledge of mys swing and what happened to it I agree with John…but can see the other side also.

And here is the link:

secretinthedirt.com/index.ph … start=1375

It is page 56 of the thread if that doesn’t work.

[nfbandon]

Jason Dufner “weighs” in:

[RangeRat]

Yeah, it’s pretty crazy over there sometimes nfbandon, and I think maybe because there are many different styles being discussed and some don’t see, or know, the major differences between them so they are talked about like they are the same.

Like Lag said, you can’t know what you don’t know, and can’t do what you can’t know…or at least at a minimum, sense.

I like Bradleys use of the term holding angles, yet some over there say “I’m always getting rid of angles” in some push slap attempt- which is fine by me if that is what floats one’s boat. However, if one works hard to store angles why on earth would anyone want to give it up too soon.

I see it in other terms, but is the same general neighborhood as Two and Lag say, of hitting with a shorter radius and shorter club, since we harness CP along with cocked wrists. Any left too early and you can kiss that goodbye. Another way I sense it is…I am at address in dynamic balance even though I am sort of of statically there, I am anticipating what is to come in terms of dynamics. So there I stand in a dynamic balance with a club that is built totally out of balance statically by design.

That left quick move I believe is an attempt to get the club to ‘feel’ dynamically balanced where the clubhead mass feels equal on both sides of the shaft centerline axis.

So we have this…dynamic address balance, holding an unbalanced instrument ( opposed ) and the first sign of too much left to make the club ‘feel’ more balanced from its inbalanced state will at that precise moment cause a ‘momentary and almost imperceptable’ inversion to imbalance with the body to stabilize the opposing forces…like a ghost note in music.

Much better to keep the radius short ( bent arm ) and shorter club ( cocked wrist ) and the club in static imbalance all the way and go like hell, but have to drop down first to do that…and stay dynamically balanced throughtout transporting an unbalanced instrument and the noggin will figure out how to do that.

Kind of abstract for some perhaps, just how I sense it.

[crr]

just got home from vacation and i’ve been chomping at the bit to try the right leg swing. very interesting results.

one of my major challenges has been avoiding the trap of over acceleration in transition. it seems almost like just taking practice swings in the spirit of the right leg loading swing john posted acts as a master sequencer for the golf swing–for me at least. in other words, the only way i can do it is if i sequence all the moving parts correctly at the right tempo.

if one tries this, one will quickly figure out that the only way one can swing with any power at all is to wait for the free ride down. once the right elbow (for a right hander) gets near or in front of the right hip and ONLY THEN can one turn, push, and accelerate. in other words, you have to wait to get your arms and hands down in front of you before you turn. that’s it. there is no other way to do it. and like that…voila, over-acceleration cured and the rest of the swing is put together nicely. the interesting thing is that the feeling of the hands coming down in front of you and essentially being between your legs through impact is one of total connection to the pivot, like there is nothing at all in the way through impact.

linked is a few one leg practice swings and the resultant full swing after about fifteen minutes. i can see myself spending a lot of time on one leg in the near future…

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ONrZlbu4sD4[/youtube]

[eagle]

That swing looks pretty dad-burned good to my eye.

[LipOut]

@crr

just got home from vacation and i’ve been chomping at the bit to try the right leg swing. very interesting results.

one of my major challenges has been avoiding the trap of over acceleration in transition. it seems almost like just taking practice swings in the spirit of the right leg loading swing john posted acts as a master sequencer for the golf swing–for me at least. in other words, the only way i can do it is if i sequence all the moving parts correctly at the right tempo.

if one tries this, one will quickly figure out that the only way one can swing with any power at all is to wait for the free ride down. once the right elbow (for a right hander) gets near or in front of the right hip and ONLY THEN can one turn, push, and accelerate. in other words, you have to wait to get your arms and hands down in front of you before you turn. that’s it. there is no other way to do it. and like that…voila, over-acceleration cured and the rest of the swing is put together nicely. the interesting thing is that the feeling of the hands coming down in front of you and essentially being between your legs through impact is one of total connection to the pivot, like there is nothing at all in the way through impact.

linked is a few one leg practice swings and the resultant full swing after about fifteen minutes. i can see myself spending a lot of time on one leg in the near future…

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ONrZlbu4sD4[/youtube]

Regardless of what I think on the topic - I would echo Eagle’s comments and say that you’ve got some pretty good stuff going on there and you’ve come a long way. Not perfect but who the hell is? Cheers and well done CRR.

[crr]

thanks guys…my ‘actual’ golf swing on a course or a range is not quite so pretty, mostly because i get fast in transition which keeps me nice and steep. something about needing to send the ball out into space ruins my transition. hitting into a net is a little different.

i guess this is why i found it so interesting that the one leg swings are apparently so effective at sequencing the transition, because it allows you to hit as hard as you can (which i tend to like to do) but only until after the transition happens appropriately. i suspect that i would dislocate the right hip bone out of the right hip joint if i didn’t…

[Rousseau]

Thanks for that, the distinction between mass and weight is an important one that’s rarely made. Are we saying that at impact, the mass is left but the weight is in the right leg?
From your description then the ground forces through the right leg are down, out and then in. Would this be visable on force plates?

I always feel like my transition is a lean left with the lower half, simular to a pitch shot. I’m not sure that I creat any ‘push’ with the right leg. Not consciously anyway.

What’s the issue with the S&T shift sideways? Presumably when misunderstood it leads to a lack of pivot action?

[lagpressure]

If you “stack” weight on the left foot at the top, then you are limiting if not eliminating the positive effect of weight transferring from the right foot to the left during the impact arena. This transfer of weight and mass aids in resisting the forces of impact to keep the clubhead moving through the ball… helping minimize deceleration of the clubhead. The less the clubhead decelerates the better. This is also the reason we should work as heavy a clubhead through impact as we can handle. In general, golf clubs are too light. When you look at the clubs used by the greatest strikers, you see a lot of lead tape and beefed up golf clubs for this reason.

The other big problem with stacking weight on the left foot at the top is the decrease or elimination of proper spine tilt. Spine tilt creates a passageway or slot for the arms to come down freely on the downswing and aides in proper rotation of the shoulders, weight transfer to the right foot and aids in saving shoulder rotation for later in the swing when it is needed the most.

You really didn’t hear the term “getting stuck” until this stacking craze became the talk of the golf world. If the spine is reverse shifting, the arms can’t get behind the torso properly, and any attempt to do so leaves the player feeling “stuck”.

[twomasters]

Leo Diegel could apparently shoot par and better playing off just his right leg

[chris_golf]

@lagpressure

If you “stack” weight on the left foot at the top, then you are limiting if not eliminating the positive effect of weight transferring from the right foot to the left during the impact arena. This transfer of weight and mass aids in resisting the forces of impact to keep the clubhead moving through the ball… helping minimize deceleration of the clubhead. The less the clubhead decelerates the better.

The other big problem with stacking weight on the left foot at the top is the decrease or elimination of proper spine tilt. Spine tilt creates a passageway or slot for the arms to come down freely on the downswing and aides in proper rotation of the shoulders, weight transfer to the right foot and aids in saving shoulder rotation for later in the swing when it is needed the most.

You really didn’t hear the term “getting stuck” until this stacking craze became the talk of the golf world. If the spine is reverse shifting, the arms can’t get behind the torso properly, and any attempt to do so leaves the player feeling “stuck”.

IMO you can be a right anchor player like Lee Trevino, who worked inside his feets. Or center anchor, like Sam Snead - who
was maybe the most centered player ever. Third option is left anchor, like Ben Hogan…
Maybe it has to fit your biomechanics and what feels more instinctive.
Personally I play my short Irons left anchor, middle Irons center anchor and my woods right anchor - this feels to me
natural. Even if I play left anchor there is still plenty of weight transfer and pressure flow.
There is a solution for left anchor players to have enough spine tilt…

Chris

[twomasters]

I am sure many have seen this video below

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aw-nt0eTb2w[/youtube]

I am involved in the largest one day pro am in Australia which is to be held on Monday November 12 at Woodlands GC in Melbourne.
Manuel De Los Santos (in video above) has been flown in to play the event and I had the opportunity to meet him today and watch him hit some balls on the range before we went and did a radio interview at MMM 105.1 to promote the day. Anyone in Melbourne should try get out and take a look at not only myself and Manuel but to get an up close look at other great pros and a whole host of celebrities who are taking part.
Inspirational stuff…

[tinman143]

Great post and thanks for sharing Bradley.

Tin