LIV golf? Where does golf go from here?

Not sure if anyone is interested???

Seems the game is changing…is this golfs version of a lockout or strike?

Hard to call it a strike since the PGA Tour is basically run by and for the players. Arnold Palmer was the founding force behind the PGA Tour when they split away from the PGA of America.

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Idk but I have hardly searched for any scores or tourny winners. Its almost like Koepka, Bubba, Decham, Reed, Johnson all left the country or something. Phils the only one in the news and it aint good. @72holeouts

Money lured but that doesnt mean fans followed

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Good points.

Now the PGA tour seems to be making updates…more money for players, missed cut money possible? Very odd…

Cultural? Who knows…I feel like the sport is saturated, maybe this is more of a big RESET button.:man_shrugging:

Seems like the right time to start a persimmon tour and actually roll the game back to the great game. This would show who is really interested in the great game and who is not.

I have always disliked the closed shop exempt tour. Back in the old days, they would have 35 open spots on Monday for locals, or regional players and a complete culture of pros who would follow around the tour for the Monday Q. If you get it and make the cut, then you play the next week. It was like this when I played on the Australian and Canadian Tours.

No reason to have 125 exempt spots every week. 60 is enough for the guys who did well the year before. Then just let the Monday hopper see who is playing well at the time.

Such a better system and much more fair… and guarantees that hot player can get right back on the tour.

With the Monday 4 spot, they would often have that on two local courses… so it was really a 2 spot, and you would have to shoot 65 to get in. (a persimmon and blade 65) hit all the par 5’s in two on a par 68 essentially.

I remember guys would bogey two of the first three holes and just walk in… as they knew they were not going to shoot 65 that day.

So when they had 35 spots on Monday, you could shoot 70 or 71 and be in a PGA Tour event three days later… very exciting for folks… local pros… really kept the dream alive for everyone.

Now I am pretty sure they got rid of the all the Monday qualifiers for tour events… and you now have to play on the Korn Ferry for a year etc… to get onto the PGA… something like that… which I think is very anti golf.

Golf should be about who is playing good NOW!.. not last year etc. The Monday Q was great.

That all being said, LIV…is also a closed shop… invite only thing… they are using a different model… like NBA, NFL… signing players to contracts to play…

But I really think they had all this better in the early days of the PGA Tour… the game was correct, the parameters, courses, gear, qualifiers, who’s hot could play now… kept everyone excited and motivated… and it was a very interesting adventure for young golfers.


Great stuff Lag…thanks for sharing! Sounds very utopian…lol

Also, they still have monday quals…even pre quals for the monday quals if you have no status. PGA tour only, Korn Ferty still does regular Monday’s.

120-200 guys fighting for 4-8 spots…-8 minimum. Basically playing a par 64, at 7-7300 yards, 50y wide fairways, and no trees that ive seen yet. Haha.

Its near impossible if you cant bang it over 330 consistently, or stuff it with 5i all day. Pins are typically generous, and you get at least 1 drivable par 4.

If you make more than one bogey, you might as well quit. But most dont because its $500/pop. Not to mention the astronomical boarding fees.

For anyone curious…the game isnt for blue collar grinders anymore

Blockquote For anyone curious…the game isnt for blue collar grinders anymore

I talked with JE about his tour experiences. Even back then you needed a backer to get you started on tour.

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Boy o boy, the Shark is relentless, and smart too. Just the other day he reached out to me about a new LIV golf message board and said LIV would pay me $1000.00 per post as long as I guaranteed LIV a minimum of 10 posts per day, sounds doable…Lag, your offer is? :grinning:

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Stay out of the dumpster Rat, sometimes they spontaneously light on fire! :rofl: :rofl: :rofl:

Relentless is an understatement…

I don’t think Lag will counter offer. He Doesn’t seem like the capitalist the shark is. He started this site without a plan for growth. :grinning:. He seems very sincere unlike the shark. GWS was a talent but found ways to lose in big moments. Who names themselves the GWS btw? I still don’t understand how Norman missed that shot into the grandstands on 18 in 86 masters with his technique???

Joaquin Niemann the latest casualty, man that’s brutal, what a player he is.

I suppose you can’t blame them for wanting to take the free cash, but some of these guys are the next greats of the game. If the likes of Hovland, Morikawa, etc., start to go, then it really is a different game. The way Matt Wolff’s game has gone, I could see him being tempted.

I would have preferred a roll back to a persimmon and blades tour with a softer spinnier ball… and then have the guys play for those huge checks…

But maybe this opens the door for something new… or gets people thinking outside the PGA Tour box.

A lot of sports are very diversified… 100’s of genres of auto racing, etc…
players and fans could gravitate to what they are most interested in.


I do see some room for growth in this game, but I don’t think it’s toward slowing down the technology aspects. This has created a lot of new jobs in the industry. Just like the government system grows until it consumes all around it, or is defeated by a better system. Is LIV better?

I personally, have had enough of the PGA tour and it’s affiliates. It’s boring as hell…and it’s definitely a class protected organization. People don’t realize it, but they are basically watching the rich kids play golf against each other. Maybe I’ve missed it, but I haven’t seen a blue collar golfer on tour in decades. No Trevino’s, no Hogan, no Nelson, no Snead. And if someone says Tiger, I’ll slap the shit out of you…he’s a silver spooner just as much as the rest of these jokes. I mean, who the fudge complains about having to wear pants when you are a well paid entertainer? 9 figures too!!!

The pointless lawsuits just prove how stupid this tour is…but I digress.

LIV isn’t going to make it better by making it louder, wearing shorts, playing less, etc. It does appeal to the youth though, so maybe that’s good. I just think it’s a soft tour for soft people…but I am ex military white trash, so…there’s that perspective I guess.

The world is changing…has been forever. We are just waves crashing on the beach. I only wish money didn’t drive every damn decision on the planet. A persimmon league on classic tracks with shot tracers and drones could be damn fun to watch…but it’s just a pipe dream.


There are always a few - Finau came from a poor family, for example. But, as a general rule, wealthier kids have way more opportunity in golf.

I agree the tour is boring. I watch maybe one round of each major at most, nothing else. Not sure I care for LIV either, haven’t followed any of their events in the slightest.

Persimmon Tour is just a matter of adding money and stir. We came very close to getting it launched back in 2012. We had three investors come to the table to discuss it. All of them could have written the check to get it off the ground.

We proposed ten 100K events across the country, playing mostly former courses that hosted PGA Tour events in the past but were no longer being utilized to do so. The prize money would have been similar to top mini tour events, but in this case, the purses would be guaranteed and not put up by the players with high entry fees. The entry fees from the players would just cover “leasing” the course for the week. Some budget for advertising, but with social media, the word would spread like wildfire.

People in the press LOVE the story. There is a LOT for a journalist to write about. Can a modern player use the classic gear and shoot 66 like Lanny Watkins did on the same course? It brings relevant apples to apples comparisons from one generation to another. People like that.

Imagine interviews with former pros from the last generation… or having them out at the event to award the trophy. It would be a great tribute to the past players, but also a great opportunity for the young players to show how good they really are.

Once launched, I think a lot of sponsors would jump on board, and the purses could go up.

We actually had Deane Beman on the phone for two hours. He was excited and supportive.

Unfortunately, all three investors collapsed, and I just figured the timing was not right for some reason. Not sure it would be better now, but I am sure it would be a success once it gained some traction.

It would give hope to younger pros who don’t fit the modern mold and might play a game that is more clever or articulate.

If professional women’s softball can exist… I am sure a classic persimmon golf tour could also exist at some level.

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Great stuff! Sounds like you have the sales pitch down. I don’t know…is it better to cast a line when the water is murky or clear? I’m no fish…but I think you are right about the timing. I would say now is not the right time either…but I’d love to see some commentary about it on podcasts. Maybe @twomasters can get something like that going since he’s inside the ropes. Hell, a charity event once a year would be enough of a “tip of the cap” for most.

I havent even watch 1 min of LIV tour. But I am 60 yo and wear a hat where the bill of hat is still curved.

Whos two masters? Player or caddie?


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