Oh yeah, that was to Eagles question…
Papi,
You had a link to a demo, where a man used a baseball bat with a handle on it, near the butt, attached at 90 degrees …he used it to show that the hands worked with each other, but differently. Fulcrum seemed to be between the hands. Also, he used it to show that it wasn’t the right elbow straightening that caused a good hit.
Can you post it on this thread? That is what I am asking about the fulcrum point…is there an ideal place for it? How do the hands work around it?
Also what BOM222 said is new and interesting to me…his proposing that the fulcrum point might “float”.
LCDV…I understand what you said…hands work together…I’m still trying to consider all this, and would wonder what you think of Papi’s video if he can post it.
thanks/eagle
LCD
While being on the topic of balls would you mind testing thenew TM Penta ball because apparently it does everything. They are not available here in Canada and too much snow. And most importantly I am not good with my compression these days (Read any days). 
cc, you might find this thread interesting: link to thread on puttertalk.com
The problem with releasing the number #1 power accumulator in TGM, is that as you are straightening the right arm, your hands are moving towards the bal
I was gonna wait until I got home but when I saw that…who needs a job anyway hehe
As all of you guys know I never read TGM, never will and when I see stuff like THAT I’m glad I didn’t. WOW. Now wonder Mac had to go to Q school like 18 times. Now y’all are getting into the sequencing and even I AIN’T GONNA GIVE THAT UP FOR FREE… Sorry but that ride requires a ticket. Took me 15 years to put that puzzle together and I did it by hand.
[i]is this what you are talking about when you refer to X? a vertical hinging of the wrists to create the load?
homepage.mac.com/brianmanzella/. … ctpic3.gif
and to Y? a horizontal hinging to create load?
homepage.mac.com/brianmanzella/. … ctpic2.gif [/i]
Exactly, and the Y move like that is what never can happen in that manner anywhere in the downswing.
are you talking about how you hinge your wrist on the way back when your refer to “X” or how you release them on the way down?
Both, you have to get it completely set there in some manner but it’s on the way down that’s important.
what do you think about these two ways of setting the wrist on the way back? Brian Manzella demonstrates a horizontal and vertical setting of the wrists, and condones a vertical hinging of the wrist. it seems to me that if you take the club straight back as long as you can to get it to the 4:30 line position then you will hinge the wrist in a vertical fashion. how do you set your wrists on the way back?
brianmanzella.com/forum/golf … again.html
Whoa! That’s one way to do it I guess but I wouldn’t teach anybody that unless they pissed me off. You can do whatever the hell you want to get there, as long as you do get there. Storytime. That’s all style and what your mindset is. You can do it like Trevino or like Bobby Jones or like Hogan or like Moe Norman or whoever. Best if you do it naturally. That stuff Manzella is doing I think is backward and awful but whatever floats your boat. It comes down to 2 different schools of thought though, either working the club square to the target line or square to the body. It changes the path of the swing everywhere but THROUGH THE ZONE. They both work but it’s up to the player to choose one and work from there.
LCD
While being on the topic of balls would you mind testing thenew TM Penta ball because apparently it does everything. They are not available here in Canada and too much snow. And most importantly I am not good with my compression these days (Read any days).
You’ll have to wait until about at the soonest Easter to get a answer unfortunately. I can count on both hands the number of rounds I’ve played since I moved out here in 03. I’ve been hitting rage balls for a few weeks. My lines suck, my move sucks, I’m lucky to get halfway back or through and I couldn’t break an egg with a sledghammer right about now… It’s gonna take months to back into shape and longer to even begin to drop it into the slot. I’d love it if the new TM Ball was any good but somehow I doubt it. They make all the balls for one thing now, going so far in the woods you have to buy more. Depressing but true.
Papi,
You had a link to a demo, where a man used a baseball bat with a handle on it, near the butt, attached at 90 degrees …he used it to show that the hands worked with each other, but differently. Fulcrum seemed to be between the hands. Also, he used it to show that it wasn’t the right elbow straightening that caused a good hit.
That line of thinking is pretty on the money when you’re hitting a baseball on a basically horizontal plane with a round bat but that leaves out the added dimension in the golf swing which is clubface to deal with. Totally changes all the dynamic motions and the way everything works. In a baseball swing you have the option of hiiting the ball with either the clubface or the bottom of the club, in fact that changes based on where you hit the ball in the depth of the zone, if you see the analogy. You’re not creating contact dependent upon two different seperate loads and a rollover is a whole different thing with a round bat. In this instance the hitting a baseball move the hands do work independently and the fulcrum point is between the hands (see Ty Cobb). In a pivot driven golf swing though the hands have to work cohesively and in a unified force to apply the Y load through the zone. If the hands work independently the loads are never created in the first place and the whole thing unravels.
And again why am I not making any money for any of this? I hate being stupid and right…
Now this is how I see swing dynamics:
thehurl.wikidot.com/trebuchet:trebuchets
That’s what I want when I pull the trigger. Y’all can have your baseball bats, I want this.
Plus if you look at one with wheels you see the reverb in the hips someone was talking about in Rory McElroy’s swing. Fire one…
that’s leverage.
Add torque and there’s your Y Load
So much for keeping those cards close to your chest… savage video
Aha! Attack the golf course! Raze the clubhouse!! Oh ho! There’s the beer cart girl…. Sorry, got carried away. 
Cheers,
Captain Chaos
Actually I’d kinda like a few days with those things at most of the holes at Poppy Hills. Sure couldn’t make it any worse…
There really are three motions… the up and down cocking… the rotation of the forearms, and flattening of the right wrist which is typically a no no… UNLESS, you do it correctly… then it can be used in a beneficial way if the pivot can out race it.
The intention can be in place in a big way, but this is very advanced stuff… tread with caution.
Golf is so unlike other sports which are more instinctive and intuitive… so much of what I have learned in the last ten months is the opposite of the way I thought it was supposed to be.
Ya you refer to it as straightening the right, I think more about under with the left just to keep it more realistic. Straightening the right is the difference between trig and calculus. I’ve never gotten close to being able to enter the third dimension in my move. At it’s best I was doing pretty deadhanded forearm moves. That’s why I’ve never gotten as deep in the slot as you. That’s plain as day from that youtube I saw. I’m not evil enough to start getting into THAT for no particular reason. I don’t even get all of it and that’s fine by me. I just wanted to get a good mental image in the open for what compression is instead of all the pointless COAM stuff that doesn’t go anywhere. I’m not screwing everything up, I’m trying to remember.
Aiguille: Your post caught my attention big time. I know I’ll get blasted by others, but IMO, golf is as instictive as anything other endeavor. Do we need lessons to learn how to walk when at that age we do not understand language or direction? No, we learn by OUR OWN INNATE ABILITY TO SENSE AND FEEL POSITIONS RELATIVE TO OUR OBJECTIVE. As a child, we got out of our own way to learn what’s best. We can experience mechanics through feel, we are all born with that ability- it’s a survival mechanism. Do we as adults, need instructions on how to twist open a door knob?. No. Once we know how that feels we can CHOOSE to twist open that knob in myriad ways given that some methods are more efficient that others. But whatever method we choose for an endevor, we must make sure that the component parts fit. Example, I can put a Ford head on a Chevy block and get that motor to run but not very effectively. Spoken like a true Detroiter!!!