Bradley,
Earlier on in this thread you were kind enough to give us your view on the 5 best ballstrikers you had played with. Who would you say was the most scary on the greens?
Cheers,
Arnie
The best putter I have seen is Tiger- NO-ONE has made more must make putts that mattered at the right time than he has…Period
Craig Parry- I would have to rate Paz as probably the best day in and day out putter that I have played with a lot. Anyone can get lucky for 1 day or 2 days, but I have played with Craig in at least 75 tournament rounds and practice rounds and he just flat out rolls that rock spot on each and every day we have ever played. His stroke has beat me to the finish line more than once, that little bast$#d
Peter Senior- Even though he uses a long putter, he wields that thing like a magic wand. He did help me out on one occasion by missing a short putt for me end up with the win in the 93 Aust Masters , however I have probably played with Pete close to 50-60 times and he is as good as there is from anything inside 25 foot. He rolls 25 and 30 foot putts into the hole like they are 4 footers for most people.
David Toms- He has a long flowing stroke that keeps it’s speed throughout. He never jabs a putt. Just smooth and flowing and the ball rolls great. He doesn’t make every putt he looks at, but if they don’t go in they frighten the hole to death.
Ian Baker-Finch- Finchy had the smoothest purest looking stroke of anyone I have played with. We have played at least 100 rounds together and even when he was hitting the ball awful his putting stroke still held up. He actually used to carry a piece of paper around in his wallet that read “I am the greatest putter …”…he would take it out and read it and believe it. His stroke was real low back and through with a slight arc to it…beautiful to watch and he certainly holed many putts in his day.
Great stuff here TwoM…
I was wondering what your thoughts are on lie angle. Do you go as flat as Lag suggests for the hitting protocol, or does your swing require something different? Then again, I’m sure you could pick up a shovel and make it work…
which is a nice segue as I was reading the Bubba Watson story in GD this month and was struck by a number of things, but especially the bit about him playing a round using a 4 wood for every shot and shooting 77. That’s strong. There were a couple of other nuggests in there about how he plays by feel and doesn’t need yardages, and just innately knows how to work the ball, and does so more than anyone else on tour. Lag might enjoy playing a round with him I bet…
Cheese
This has been a big talking point with myself and Lag- lie angle !!
When we first stuck our heads together and discussed my swing, Lag only knew what it used to be like in the late 80’s early 90’s.
Amazingly then, I had never been fitted for a set of clubs. Didn’t know what lie angle I needed -nothing. I had never even seen a loft lie machine. I would just say a hair flat or standard when I had a set made up for me. In those days there was a lie standard and it was far away from the way they make clubs today. So I could just pick up clubs , waggle them, look at them and say yeah that looks good , I can hit that. I know from memory that I used some Tommy Armour 845’s at one point and they were flat lie angle option (they didn’t give specifics…they just had standard-flat-upright)— lot simpler then !!!
So from that I know I used flat clubs - and all this was before I got tuition
Once I received coaching I can tell you that I have some irons in my garage that are 4 degrees upright !! Of course that turned my swing into a more upright shaft plane swing, I stopped being able to release on the ball as hard and well it hurt me.
On the suggestion of Lag I bent a set down about 3 degrees (I have a Mitchell in my garage) to start with. It looked weird to my eye but after a little while it felt good to hit and the visual didn’t bother me at all. Then after a little while I bent then down some more and have now adjusted to that. I have my 5 iron at 57 now. Some of my other sets the 5 iron is at 61 or more!! Now I pick up some of those old sets and puke at how bad they look to my eye sitting as upright as they do.
This has certainly helped with my swing and pivot. Lag mentioned a great thing the other day to me- The swing is an arc, the ball is a circle- where are all the straight lines in golf that people talk about?
My old upright club setup and swing tried to make it a game of straight lines and it isn’t.
The flatter you can have your clubs the better- it promotes a lot of good features needed in the swing
I oversighted Brad Faxon as a great putter- only because I really haven’t played with him much- but he has it all going for him on the greens
Non mechanical- feels the putt with his feet and hands- just lets the putter flow back and forth with the hands leading and keeps the blade relatively low throughout with a good solid hit of the ball- and then he just goes and picks the ball out of the hole. Non complicated trust and belief that he is going to make the putt and if he doesn’t he believes he will make the next one. he never ever lets a miss of one putt determine the outcome of his next putt- great attitude
Bradley,
I tried your chipping method yesterday and as you say, its easy as pie once you get used to it, made a number of tap in up and downs yesterday thanks to your tip.
Just wondered what the maximum distance you would use this technique for and indeed, whether it translates into your full swing at all.
I know from the iseek thread that you are keen on ‘presenting the bounce’ even for fuller shots.
Thanks again, my short game needed a little injection of confidence.
Aiguille,
I would use that similar setup anywhere up to 40-50 yards with a lob wedge, a little farther for a sand wedge/gap wedge 60-75 yards, and up to around 90-100 yards if I am using a wedge and trying to hit a half type shot that eliminates some spin
I think once the yardage gets too far out of range for that narrower stance and chest leaning forward style we have to fall back to a little bit more of a regular shot. It all depends on the shot also, but it works a treat for most of those as long as we don’t force the issue and start to hit too hard and then get too steep into the ball.
I think it translates a little into wedge play on a full shot scenario. Because…we should be using a narrower stance for our wedges as the shaft is shorter and we don’t need all that width in our stance to create and keep our balance. The narrower stance therefore positions the ball more towards the middle of the stance which in turn gives us a little more up and down spine angle instead of a tilted spine angle that occurs when we have a wider stance.
That more up/down spine angle then still creates that forward chest lean a little and we can then always still hit down and through the shot and not have too much spine tilt which can cause problems and may promote an early release with those clubs that then brings on the fat and thin shots.
Many many players still talk about having an open stance for their wedges- why?..it allows that weight and spine angle to lean forward a hair and helps create the sensations I have talked about above
Bradley,
Thank you for your reply and passing on your technique. I would definitely recommend it to other students.
Could you say a few words about your take on presenting the bounce of the club with chips and full shots?
Bounce is on the club for a reason- to be used
It is obviously more noticeable with wedges as they have more bounce built in by design.
The concept is to never swing to steep (which goes hand in hand with Lag’s idea of flatter is better!!)
If you swing too steep you never get to use the bounce as the leading edge just rips into the ground and you can walk 10 yards ahead of where you were and prepare for your next shot from there.
At least by using a rounded slightly downward swing at impact the bounce gets into play and can help you.
Ever hit shots off a mat? If you do hit behind the ball a little the bounce saves you and you can get away with a somewhat decent shot from a a somewhat average hit.
Bounce is especially important around the greens and wedge shots because it is designed for you to provide the lift of the ball without physically having to lift the ball yourself. That’s why I always talk about having an open clubface in comparison to your target line when around the greens. The rear of the club/sole is what we want to hit the ground with-the bounce- not the leading edge. Most courses are normally soft. Bounce plays a huge role on those wet or soft or normal lies we are confronted with.
So like above with the mat- even if you do hit a pitch or chip fat- if you use the club how it was designed the bounce can/will actually save you and you will get some type of result with the shot even your mishits.
Leading edge works well when the ground is hard and packed because it digs in and gives you some way of getting the face onto the ball…and that’s about it for leading edge usage.
Bounce is king otherwise it wouldn’t be on the club
Two- do you usually chip with one go to club or do you vary it depending on the circumstances? Sorry if you’ve already covered this.
Cheese
Any club I feel like I can do the job with… I normally work on carrying the ball a few feet or yards on the green and let it roll the rest- unless there are tiers or big uphill/downhill/sidehill roll to worry about then it all goes by feel and what I think gives me the best chance to hole it or get it close
My favorite chipping clubs would be 54 degree and 7 iron
I was reading Bob Rosburg’s short game book from the eary 1960’s, and he talks about using the least lofted club you can,
therefore just carrying the ball onto the green and letting it roll all the way out… often using a 4 iron to chip with on the long ones… Of course the greens were slower back then, and they didn’t have all the retired elephants from the circus buried under the greens like they do today… 
An 8 iron seems to be my “go to” club for basic chips… and then either a wedge or sand wedge depending on the lie or if I have to pop it up…
When I was on tour I spent a lot of time chipping, and even more time putting… I relied upon having a very heavy, dead handed sensation, with a longer slower VERY feel oriented approach… this worked well for me… as long as I put the time in at the practice area each week…
After not playing golf at all for 15 years… I learned what I was good at and not good at… My first few rounds after such an extensive layoff made me realize that I was truly a very good ball striker… my putting was pretty average, my chipping was not good, and my wedge play was poor. I really believe that if you are good at something, you own it…
It was so clear to me what I had to do coming back to the game… my goals were to embrace a technique that would be rock solid without having to practice… I am just not interested in practicing… I enjoy playing golf on a great shotmakers course…
and I felt that I had a great opportunity to get in touch with what really works…
I found that a short compact accelerating descending blow around the greens was the answer… the feeling that the grass has no chance of slowing or snagging the club.
With my wedge play, it was the same concept… just shorten and firm it all up. I found that if you just make good solid contact, firm and aggressive through impact, it made it easy to get the ball online, so I just needed to find the right mental keys to control distance. After finding the ball going over the greens, I just simply tricked my brain by picking a target just short of the green to hit to, then made the same firm aggressive swing to that preliminary target… the ball would fly long
of that and started ending up near the pin rather than going over the green. Over the months my brain finally adjusted that feel, and now I just look and hit… and that’s it… also flattening out my wedges to 6 degrees flat, has really helped keep the ball online with the target…
Putting, I just had a lightbulb moment that I simply can’t feel the putter head unless I practice, so I built a new putter that is beyond heavy, installed a very stiff shaft, filled it with salt, bent the shaft forward to keep my hands ahead more, so now it just feels like the rest of my game… I can grip it firm, and hit down on it and try if anything to hook spin the putt more like Locke, and use a bit of wrist… and now I think my putting is respectable without having to practice at all, which tells me my technique is more suited to my entire approach toward the game… it finally for the first time in my life, feels a real sameness from tee to green… something I always struggled with on tour…
It’s a lot more fun to play when the entire game seems in sync from a technical standpoint… I don’t know why I didn’t figure all this out years ago… sometime you have to step back to see the forest!
Bradley,
Sorry nothing incredibly profound to add. I just wanted to say after reading this thread it’s nice to meet you here. 
Prot,
i have read your thread on iseek and keep up with it. Lag is the man…keep working with conviction and do lots of drills… the drills promote that muscle memory…the good and great days will easily outnumber the bad days once you get it under full control and reach a comfort level
I am always amazed when I play with youngsters these days, often low handicap players, that they will attempt a lob style shot when they are just a few yards from the green with no huge obstacle between them and the flag. Seldom does it produce a great result and even when it does work it could be achieved much more easily with a low running chip…I blame the PGA Tour and it coverage over here. 
BTW at what age is it acceptable to start sounding like your own dad? 
Hi Bradley,
What are your thoughts on getting ready to play? I believe Nicklaus always started on the range with an 8 iron before working up and down the set and if legend is correct this a habit that Tiger also copies. Hogan would reputedly often play a whole round with different clubs visualising the shots he would need to play on each hole and Faldo would do the same to an extent. Seve would do something similar in his heyday with clubs strewn everywhere on the practice ground as he visualised what he had to do on the course. Lag has told us he was a divot watcher and would use his warm up to understand what his shot pattern of the day would be so he was prepared to “dance with the girl” he brought when the round began. What did you find worked for you and what other odd things did you see from those warming up on the worlds tours?
Cheers,
Arnie
It all makes perfect sense…why not use the green to your advantage when chipping?
Surely it is easier to hit a ball 5 yards in front of you and then just let the contour and pace of the green do the rest for you…than to…pluck out a lob wedge and make a big swing and try and carry it 20 yards to a hole…that just brings in more chance of a mishit, of a misjudgment of distance, too much spin coming into play, more variables are opened up and unless you work at it non stop day in and day out you will never master it.
I find a 5 foot putt easier to judge and control than a 40 foot putt-- so why would I want to fly a chip 40 yards and hope it stops when I can fly a chip 5 yards and then let it go from there. I am going to hit my mark many many more times aiming at a spot 5 yards away than at a spot 40 yards away.
If I swing smaller I have less room for error–golf is complicated enough without throwing in other unnecessary risks- Keep it simple
Warming up before play is just that- warming up. Loosen up the muscles you will be using and feel that ball hitting the face and the body motion that goes with it.
It is always best to start out with lofted clubs. It is less of an action- easier to control and loosens you up better until you are ready to use all the muscles needed in a bigger arc swing with the longer clubs.
I concentrate on just feeling my body. Trying to warm the engine up. Working on a good strike. When I get the strike I want I test out some varying shots- draws-fades-low-high and see what my abilities for the day are. If something seems off I won’t work on it there- it is a warm up and test to see what is working- not a practice session.
I just go through the bag- odd clubs one day- even clubs another- woods and a few pitches again to wind down and maybe finish off with a shot I need early on in the round , and if I can pull off that shot visually then i know I am ready to go…
Doesn’t take me long to warm up- again I am NOT practicing- I am just loosening up, feeling the strike and seeing what shots or feel I have to work with that day.
Practice is done after the round - never before
Interesting thoughts on warming up.
I have wondered this myself. How long do you go for though? The reason I ask is my current ‘problem’ occurs after approximately 3/4 of a bucket. SO when I’m playing I try to hit under 20 balls so the ‘problem’ isn’t quite there yet and I can trick myself into getting a round of golf. Have you ever dealt with anything of that nature? Or did you have a very stringent warm up process that stayed consistent? Did you change anything when you were having a problem?
I go with the attitude that Lag talks about- ‘dancing with the girl you brought’- for the round
My amount of balls varies… I don’t set it in stone to hit 10 with each club or go through an entire bucket… I start off working on my one feel I want-which for me is a mini swing starting at P3 and then up and into P5. I find that my one thought to have. That will be my practice swing in an attempt to feel that and ingrain that, it is not my thought as I am hitting balls…only my practice swing for feel- then I just work on strike- ability to control the ball how I want- and make sure I am fully loosened up and ready to go.
If my swing feels a little off and they aren’t quite what I envisioned then I have a go to shot of just working it left to right all day- no matter the shot. At least that way I know I can get it around the course that way and then after the round I will proceed to work on the area that was slightly off to get the swing back in the order I want it to be in.
I will normally chip and putt first- then go warm up on the range. that way my swing is more oily and ready to go- so I can just go hit the first tee without much cool down period.
Normally I only need 15 minutes to get fully warmed up and through the bag .